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Forgive me, but if this were me, who would be liable or not would not be my first concern. That would be my mom. I would be worried that stepdad, in his depression, may think he’d be doing Mom “a favor” by deliberately overdosing her. Being stubborn and cantankerous is fine as long as it just concerns him. But he’s dragging Mom into the mix. Can you just take the meds? I agree that Dad probably wouldn’t care if someone threatened him with being liable. Step in and take the meds. If you want to fib, tell him the place has a new policy; no more self-medicating. Say there have been too many break-ins with people looking for drugs. Say he has no choice but to let someone else handle the dosing. Protect your mom.
Chopin68, it is ok to tell Step-Dad a "theraputic fib". Such as, if Mom gets the wrong dosage, takes too many pills, or takes no pills at all, he could be liable.
I am really surprised that the Assisted Living doesn't demand that the meds be kept under lock at the nurses station. I know my Dad wasn't allow to even have an aspirin in his room. Guess it all depends on State regulations what is allowed or not. When Dad lived in Independent Living, he used the Med-Tech option where all his meds were kept elsewhere and a Tech would bring him his daily dosages. Well worth the cost.
I too am surprised the meds aren't locked up. This is literally a disaster waiting to happen, when coupled with your father's inability to manage the meds.
As to the liability issue, the staff would be covered b/c they informed you and your family, but I don't know if there would be criminal negligence charges arising from mismanagement of the meds. There could be. You're wise to be concerned, not only for this but b/c there already seems to be some physical repercussions from the mismanagement of the meds.
From your description, he has problems of his own and shouldn't be handling med management.
Expounding on the therapeutic fib, I'd consider just lying to your father and tell him that (a) you're getting a discount on the professional med management issue b/c the staff really likes your mother, or (b) the staff will add this service gratis. Or maybe tell him the facility has changed its rules and will be handling meds for your mother (and other patients). Just don't let him see the statements from the AL facility.
Please let us know what happens. This is a scary situation.
I don't know if the liability fiblet will make much difference to him. I think the real risk is that the AL facility is likely to ask them to leave (evict) if they feel that Mom's in danger. Maybe that threat will wake up Step Dad.
Who pays the AL bill? If other than step dad is writing out the check - - - tell him the facility wants to be sure your Mom is getting the correct doses and has offered a one year free service of drug distribution. The person who writes the checks will have to be on board, but therapeutic fibbing covers a multitude of situations! : - /
Chopin, I am glad that you are being so proactive about this. It truly sounds like a power struggle with your dad with your mom as the victim. I feel better about your decision. It’s not easy to do and be prepared for some anger, resistance and sulking, but you’re protecting your mom. Sending strength!
My mom is 86, no dementia, but she is having trouble remembering things and keeping all her and my dads meds organized.
Some oldsters are still writing great novels and waterskiing at 87. Most are not. They are like my folks and your step dad. Simple tasks become challenging.
I see only the nuclear option for you. You take all the meds away and turn it over to the facility. It will be ww3 but it’s clear that something serious is going to happen soon.
Hopefully step dad will pay the freight at some point.
The fib that you have been given should work well. But if worst comes to worst, tell him flat out that having him manage your mom's medication and leaving them out for her to get, has landed her in the ER and he isn't compentent enough to manage it so the AL is taking that over. Sometimes putting the fear of god into somebody is the only thing that will work.
In addition, some states allow outside dosage folks to come in and administer meds. When I last looked, it was cheaper to what the facility would charge. Just another option to explore...
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
I am really surprised that the Assisted Living doesn't demand that the meds be kept under lock at the nurses station. I know my Dad wasn't allow to even have an aspirin in his room. Guess it all depends on State regulations what is allowed or not. When Dad lived in Independent Living, he used the Med-Tech option where all his meds were kept elsewhere and a Tech would bring him his daily dosages. Well worth the cost.
As to the liability issue, the staff would be covered b/c they informed you and your family, but I don't know if there would be criminal negligence charges arising from mismanagement of the meds. There could be. You're wise to be concerned, not only for this but b/c there already seems to be some physical repercussions from the mismanagement of the meds.
From your description, he has problems of his own and shouldn't be handling med management.
Expounding on the therapeutic fib, I'd consider just lying to your father and tell him that (a) you're getting a discount on the professional med management issue b/c the staff really likes your mother, or (b) the staff will add this service gratis. Or maybe tell him the facility has changed its rules and will be handling meds for your mother (and other patients). Just don't let him see the statements from the AL facility.
Please let us know what happens. This is a scary situation.
Tell Dad whatever you need to. Mom's meds need to be managed professionally. Doctor's orders, dad!
Some oldsters are still writing great novels and waterskiing at 87. Most are not. They are like my folks and your step dad. Simple tasks become challenging.
I see only the nuclear option for you. You take all the meds away and turn it over to the facility. It will be ww3 but it’s clear that something serious is going to happen soon.
Hopefully step dad will pay the freight at some point.
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