Senior gives all assets away so 5 year penalty kicks in? What happens if help is needed and there is NO family and NOT a single penny left?

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Senior gives all assets away so 5 year penalty kicks in? What happens if help is needed and there is NO family and NOT a single penny left?

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Let's assume a senior, in basically good health, gives all assets away and suddenly needs nursing care. Medicaid looks back five years and imposes a penalty time for value of assets given away. What happens to the senior who has NO family, no one to help for money, and has absolutely nothing? Who steps in and what happens to them?

Medicaid Medicaid Lookback Medicare Open Enrollment

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Riley, are you talking about you? Are you wanting to look before you make the leap and give all your assets away to charity?

If so - don't! Make a will, and trust to your basically good health and good luck to protect your assets from the predations of long-term care needs: your charities will benefit all the same. Surely it's a risk you just don't need to take.

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Riley, PA has very different laws including filial responsibility. I do not think anyone on the board is comfortable commenting on PA, I know I am not and I am usually. Getting advice from a lawyer or even posting on Avvo may be in your best interest.

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This would apply to Pennsylvania. Please help me - I can't seem to get any answers from anyone. I want to give some money to charities whom I have helped all my life. They are far more important to me than what ultimately happens to me. But I need information on this subject - what happens if the money is gone? How can you pay back something that is no longer there (yes, they take SS, VA benefits, pensions). And if Medicaid denies you coverage, where in hell do they put you? On the street if there is not a living soul to turn to. What happens to those people? How can we protect ourselves from this end hell?

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Senior would likely become a ward of the State. The senior would likely make his/ her way to the hospital, hospital would contact elderly protective services and APS would pursue to take guardianship. If money/assets was given away, the State likely could attempt to recoup it if possible, it depends on the individual State statutes.

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" I want to give some money to charities whom I have helped all my life. They are far more important to me than what ultimately happens to me."

So, here is how it works. Let say A is an elderly woman who attends church and for the last 20 years has given $50 a week in the collection plate. When Medicaid looks at the money over the 5 years, they would consider that money an exempt gift because there was no intent to defraud and therefore no lookback penalty.

What you said in the above quote describes your intent, therefore, money would not be an exempt charitable gift. Your money is for your care and you should not expect taxpayers to foot your bill.

Private pay then when you die leave the remaining to a charity.

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This is where it is imperative that you make out a will with an attorney well versed in posthumous charity giving.

We are splitting our estate 5 ways, among our 5 kids. We wanted 10% of that bequest, in each case, to go to our church. Our attorney walked us through the benefits of 'asking' each kid to pay 10% of their own free will, as it will give them a sizeable tax break AND they will be 'safe' from any kind of lookbacks.

When we made the will all 5 of our kids were active members of our church. Now only one is, and all 4 of the 'fall aways' have stated they will still donate the 10% because we asked them to, not because they 'believe'. The $1500 spent on the attorney was money well spent.

This, is, of course, contingent upon the premise that we won't require so much care in our dotage that there is anything left to inherit. First we take care of ourselves and then whatever is left is for the kids.

I HOPE we are never dependent on the state for our care. We've saved and invested so we won't have that dynamic. I hope.

If every person who could not longer afford their NH fees were on the street, well, the streets would be choked with them.

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Here in Michigan, you fill out a Medicaid hardship waiver and then lookback does not apply. In other states, no clue.

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What is Medicaid Hardship Waiver? For Pennsylvania. Whom would be called to get someone to answer with black/white answers?

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Even if they gifted “assets”, they have some type if monthly income, like SS or other retirement. They don’t live on air. Their income Is going to be required to be a copay to the facility they are in. Probably they will have to sign off to have the facility become thier representative payee for SSA.

If there’s no family & they are not competent or cognitive, I imagine they would become a ward of the state. So they get a state appointed guardian. Guardianship confers a good deal of power. If there was skullduggery on how those assets transferred, the guardian could perhaps get APS and law enforcement to look into if someone took advantage of a vulnerable adult. There’s always a paper trail on real property and bank transactions, where the $ went & to whomever will surface.

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I have been told that any "government" agency will have every means of research available to look back for five years if applying for Medicaid. I thought accounts, etc. with banks were confidential and no information would be given out. Am I wrong?

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Any idea whom to go for to get laws for PENNSYLVANIA? I am not getting answers via computer research. H E L P.

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I would imagine an Elder attorney in Pennsylvania, specifically one who is knowledgeable in Medicaid would have some answers for you. Or possibly a financial advisor, who might be able to help you set up some sort of donation schedule that won't put you in danger of running out of assets you might need for your own care, or won't cause a Medicaid penalty.
Good luck.

Senior gives all assets away so 5 year penalty kicks in? What happens if help is needed and there is NO family and NOT a single penny left?

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