I need advice. My very generous and loving grandmother (82) has so graciously let me (37) and my 13 year old move in with her. She is a saint, ya'll. I'm super grateful for the opportunity for us to stay there while I go through my divorce, however what I've noticed is a lack of boundaries. I've discussed this with my mother a few times and she seems as confused about it as I am.
My grandmother was married to my grandfather for 40 years. During that time she worked full time, but also was the homemaker and took care of everything for him. It was/is a way she showed/shows love. She has never really lived alone either. It had been a little over a year since his passing when we moved in. As with anything new, it was an adjustment for us all however I have tried numerous times to convey that she is not our maid and doesn't have to take care of everything in the house. The last thing I want is her to be overwhelmed and feel taken for granted. She is very stubborn when it comes to adjusting her ways and it is her house, however it's as if she sees me as a child with a sibling vs her granddaughter with a child.
She will question my every decision on anything. She will follow me around the house like a puppy. She stands in the doorways of bedrooms watching me and my child do whatever we are doing. She asks me how much debt I have and when I refuse to discuss finances she won't stop asking and gets upset when I tell her not to worry about my finances. I give her rent $, but she still stresses over utility bills and fusses if my child takes a long shower. I try to implement shared chores so she isn't doing it all and she will argue with me/us and not let us do them (I know, how horrible that someone wants to do things for me), but it becomes burdensome and stresses me out, she's 82 and shouldn't be doing it all. She'll dry clothes I tell her not to. She stands behind or beside me when I try to cook. She almost acts defensive if I buy my own groceries or tell her that me and my child don't like certain foods. She moves/reorganizes things ALL THE TIME... even my own items in shared spaces (like my lotions/perfumes/makeup already put in their own container). I get it is her house and we are doing our best to be respectful but shouldn't that go both ways and she respect basic boundaries too?
My child and I and my mother have all had calm conversations with her addressing these things, but it isn't clicking. My mother and I have noticed she is becoming more forgetful of words and of things in general within the last 5-6 months, but I think that is just her age, not dementia. She refuses to wear her hearing aids and that has been a struggle because her hearing has declined over the last 2 years. Many conversations around that and a plan in place to get that corrected within the next 2 weeks.
I could use some help/advice on how to coexist but still be treated as an adult and a parent. She is not aggressive and does these things out of love and not malice, but it is very frustrating and super puzzling to me that she won't stop overstepping.
Quite likely, you and your mom are not going to be able to change her , or how she is acting. Odds are against any change.
Your best move may be to figure out how to get independent again, and you and your 13 year old move out..... then go back to a usual granddaugther-grandmother relationship as you had before, just visit her on your own terms.
"Stubbornness" is an early symptom, so is loss of recognition of boundaries, etc.
Following you around the house could be Shadowing, a dementia behavior. Sundowning is another phenomenon where her behavior, confusion and agitationi takes a turn for the worse in the afternoons.
If she is hearing impaired but refuses to wear them, then she may not be comprehending your conversations, instead acting as if she is hearing you. You need to tell her that if she doesn't agree to wear her hearing aids every day then you won't live with her. I told my own Mother (who lives next door to me) that if she doesn't wear hers every day that I will not be her care manager. I have to go there every day and put them in for her (she has arthritis and neuropathy in her hands) but she cooperates, at first she fought it.
Does your Grandma have a PoA assigned? Is it your Mom? If so this person now needs to read their PoA documents to see what activates their authority to make decisions in their best interests.
If your Grandma doesn't have a PoA this is a stickier situation. You cannot force someone with no legal representative to do anything easily. It's difficult even when you do have authority.
Now there is a dramatic learning curve if she does indeed have cognitive decline. There's no definitive test except to first discount all other possible medical problems (eg: a UTI, dehydration, stroke, vitamin deficiency, thyroid, improper medicating, etc). Then they get a cognitive test at their primary doctor clinic (and someone needs to go with her, and do not tell her the point is to take this test because you know she will balk).
You (or her PoA) can schedule her Medicare free annual wellness physical to accomplish the above. You will need to employ "therapeutic fibs" to get her to do things and go places without a fight. It is moral and ethical strategy in order to accomplish a more important goal, which is an accurate diagnosis.
If she has dementia, it is a progress disease with no cure and no real medications to help it. This forum is the place to come to continue to ask questions and get guidance. I wish you success as you figure out next steps in your situation.
Assuming that this is the case, you'll need to learn a lot about her disease. It is progressive, and there's no cure. Which is to say that she's only going to get worse. Her disease makes it impossible for her to be the way you'd like her to be. Talking to her will make no impression. Insisting on anything will make no impression. Expecting her not to argue or do the chores or anything at all is, I'm sorry to say, pointless.
Now on to the hearing aids. There's a lot of research indicating that hearing loss contributes to dementia. That's because if the ears can't hear, they can't transmit information to the brain. The connections from ear to brain then stop working because they aren't being used. If the brain can't get information, the brain can't function as it should. So the hearing-impaired person then has dementia. It's good that you have a plan to fix her hearing aid problem, but don't expect to restore brain function. What's gone is gone.
What should you do to take care of yourself and your child? Get a home of your own ASAP. Actively work toward that goal. With grandma getting worse, your child doesn't need to be growing up with what's going to happen next with her health. You both deserve a place where you can be who you want to be and do what is best for both of you. Don't let grandma's needs take over your life, which is sure to happen if you stay there.
Your child is thirteen. That's an impressionable age at which most children try to break away from family and establish an independence of sorts. You need to be there for your child, and you don't need to give your child any reason stay away from home due to turbulence within the family, the odors that come with dementia (diapers and other mess), etc. etc. You want your child to be comfortable bringing friends over, spending time with you, and so on.
"But what will happen to grandma? I love her so much!"
Not your circus, not your monkeys. Your circus and your monkeys are you and your child. Put yourself first, and good luck.
A big question here as to which of you is doing THAT, as you are living in HER home. Eeeks. Sorry to sound so mean, but that is the truth, and nothing she is doing sounds too tough for me. If she is standing in the door just say "Grandmom, I am having a moment; could I have a few minutes alone, please" and gently close the door. Be honest. Be open. But let her know when you require some space.
Word searching can be the beginnings of dementia, BUT it can also be ANXIETY and clearly your grandmother is having anxiety which seems heightened with the two of you in the household. This is a new situation and one she is clearly not at comfort with.
I just mentioned on Forum to another member, in different circumstances from yours, but having the generational melding problems as well, that it is difficult for ANY HUMAN BEINGS to live together. It is difficult for parents and children. It is difficult for brothers and sisters. For spouses and partners. For roommates even. It simply is difficult to live together, period.
You say that you have had discussions and that this is not working.
Well, then you must LIVE with it. No other choice. And you have now an opportunity to get on your feet, get a job (which, hey, THAT will take you out of the house a while) and save your money for first and last on a one bedroom apartment (kid gets the room) until you can work up to another way.
Your grandmother isn't going to get more adaptable to this. In fact, at her age she will get LESS SO. I am 81. Yeah. I would worry about how long the showers are (we in SF fighting drought so long now that it is second nature, and our PG & E in a fairly warm town is off the charts for heat and light. Yes, I would worry about just everything. Meanwhile you have a child of an age to start to want friends, her own music, and so on and so on.
You won't want to eat at the same hour.
You won't want to eat the same THINGS.
And on you go.
You are there because you are going through a difficult time.
This is the price to pay for that, so take it and embrace it. It won't change. You already know that because you already tried.
Meanwhile, get on your own two feet just as fast as you can.
There is NOTHING like the autonomy of your own home.
Good luck to you. I wish you and you child and your grandmom, too, everything good in life.
It is her home, which is why I came here for guidance. I had my own house and it is on the market for sale, which is why I am living with her... because my finances are tied up, but wasn't going to go into so much detail that it took away from the rather odd behaviors both my mom and I noticed over the last 6 months. Or behaviors that have gone unnoticed since she has lived alone the last year.
Thank you for your input, have a good day.
She wants me to clean for her but then she follows me around making sure, I'm using the right rags, or cleaners, and everything has to be just so.
She already got use to a certain ice pack, won't use anything else. It causes me so much anxiety.
And now here we are doctors appointment after appointments, and doing all the chores. Anyways there is nothing you can do to change her.
Did you ask to move into your grandmother’s home or did she offer for you to have a temporary place to stay?
The reason why I am asking is because perhaps you caught her off guard when you asked her and she caved and said yes even though she might rather live alone.
Your grandmother is used to having her own space. It’s difficult to share a home with others after you have been living alone.
Did you discuss how long that you would live in her home? Or anything else beforehand regarding living arrangements?
As far as her behavior goes, I can’t say if she has the beginning of dementia or if she is overwhelmed by the change of having family members living with her.
She’s set in her ways. Naturally, this works on your nerves and this situation isn’t good for either of you.
My grandmother had a similar situation with my uncle. He was having issues in his marriage and asked her if he could move back home for a while. Grandma told him, “Son, I love you and always will but this is your problem. It isn’t mine. Figure out your own solution to this. Leave me out of it.”
My uncle ended up going back to his wife and they remained married for over 50 years. I am NOT suggesting that you return to your husband. I am saying that your divorce isn’t your grandmother’s issue.
I know that you are paying rent and are grateful. That is wonderful. You obviously care about her. Encourage her to see a doctor if you are concerned about her cognitive functioning.
Wishing you, your son and grandmother all the best. I hope that you are able to find other living arrangements soon.
It reads to me she sees you as a child she has taken the responsobility for.
Yet you are a grown adult. Were ready & expected to live in a adult shared house arrangement.
It was a lovely gesture, that your Grandmother took you in.
Get back on your feet & find your next home for you & your child. I see you are awaiting your house to sell? Ok. So stick it out as best you can until then. The danger here is overstepping each other. Both sides.
Sometimes two women for one kitchen just does not work out.
I deal with some of the same things - mainly being treated like I am her child instead of an adult.
She also has a hearing problem but rarely wears her hearing aids, so I'm repeating things a lot and talking louder than usual.
It sounds like you are being micromanaged. That is really hard and hard to set boundaries around lest it cause some conflict.
I don't know if it's possible for some elderly people to treat a generation or two under them as adults.
I don't know what the answer is because she might be too old to change or have any self-awareness on the issues.
I guess I would go with basic boundaries without being harsh about it. I deal with the same kinds of things and most of the time, I can ignore it, but some days it really gets to me.
I just want you to know you are not alone and to try and enjoy what space you can get from it all and find ways to manage stress - deep breathing, long walks, time away as much as possible.
I am going to comment on your response to Alva.
You may be working and contributing payments to the household, but there are more issues at stake here besides money.
You can’t brush the obvious things off to the side. Look at the entire picture, then find solutions for the problems that you are facing.
Lack of money is certainly an issue for you. Money isn’t a major factor for your grandmother so regardless of whether you are paying rent or not, it doesn’t matter.
Money doesn’t solve everything in every situation.
Wishing you all the best while you sort through how to move forward in this situation.
A very wise geriatric psychiatrist told me years ago with regards to my mom that what matters is if the behavior is "new" or "always".
If the behaviors that GMA is exhibiting is out of character for her, be worried and consult with the appropriate docs.
Someone hit the nail on the head below talking about my son and I giving her purpose. It is true. She took care of my grandpa their entire marriage, up until his death. She was his caretaker until his dying days. It is in her nature to help, but odd that she is so involved that she won't let a simple task like me getting the chicken out of the freezer or finishing a load of laundry without her physically stepping in and taking over. She struggles with remembering words and names too. Not recognition, but names of tangible items and places. It is all challenging and new and different and I just want to make sure I approach things correctly or leave them be. I just don't want to dismiss something that needs addressed and you all have been so wonderful with the quick responses. Thank you again!
Thank you for caring enough about me, my son and grandma to reply and share your knowledge time and unfortunately for some, your own experiences. Have a wonderful rest of your evening and week.
Please feel free to continue to comment. I have this forum saved and will follow up with anything new.
-Stacy
Wishing you luck in finding a place for you and your son to live. Then you can visit your grandma or invite her to dinner as her granddaughter instead of being her roommate.
Or you could invite her to your new home for dinner. Grandmothers are very special people in our lives.
My mom with dementia lived with us for years and it does sounds to me like grandma has some dementia. Forgetting so many words. Shadowing. So if you look at her behavior through a dementia lens, you will be able to better tolerate and understand it. Since she seems pretty mild in her symptoms, you should be able to make it through for the next 6 months or so.
I know you work which is good so you are not together 24/7 cuz that would really be rough.
Try not to get annoyed with her overbearing behavior. When she asks you about your finances or debt or whatever that is none of her business, just keep your answer vague and light hearted. Hopefully you and your son are having some outings alone. If you're cooking and she's underfoot, try to give her a job to do. Can she cut up veggies for a salad or something like that? I can't stand to have people looking over my shoulder!
Cleaning? Just go ahead and do it. When she complains and fusses, just tell her you have some time and energy and really want to do it so there must be something else she can do elsewhere like clean another room that you're not in etc.
Best of luck!
What you say to grandma isn't clicking because she likely suffers from dementia and has lost the ability to comprehend what you're telling her. So she reverts back to her comfort zone, repeating the same patterns over and over again.
Becoming forgetful of words isn't normal aging. Struggling to find words or calling things by the wrong name is classic dementia behavior. Like calling a coffee cup a chair. Or putting car keys in the freezer, for example.
Below is a link to a good article about the 10 warning signs of dementia :
http://alzheimer.ca/en/about-dementia/do-i-have-dementia/10-warning-signs-dementia
Grandma following you around everywhere is known as Shadowing.
Below is an article from Agingcare about coping tips for Shadowing behavior:
https://www.agingcare.com/articles/shadowing-behavior-in-dementia-470434.htm
See if you and mom can get grandma to the doctor for a cognition test which is very short and simple. That will tell you where she falls on the scale and help you prepare for getting her help in the home or placing her when the time comes. Dementia is progressive and requires a plan of action by the loved ones to manage future care.
Good luck to you.
Of course you can still offer to cook, and then offer to do the dishes, etc. But when she says no let it go. That will give her less time to stand in the doorway questioning you. Maybe give her an extra $20/week for the hot water. Whatever it takes to keep the peace until you are able to move. Maybe you and your son can do more of the heavy lifting stuff, like snow removal or yard work.
Also, it sounds like this set up is still pretty new. Now that she's already moved your toiletries, etc. hopefully she will settle down and fall into a routine of having you there. In the meantime I think it's smart that mom is taking her to a doctor to be evaluated. Good luck.