Two other daughters live close and help out with evening bed time outside chores etc but are also verbally abused by this sibling.
Fear that older sibling is going to take all their hard earned money and end up having to sell their house to live due to her wasteful spending and/or embezzelment of their hard earned money. This sister feels entitled to what she is doing but it is so wrong. My parents worked hard all their lives and came from a very frugal generation. Very hard to sit back and watch this abuse. She is their POA and has also convinced my Mother to put her on as a joint account owner on their banking account.
My Mother just took out 36K to buy this sibling a new car. My Mother has told her to take money if she needs it. Apparently due to COVID running a house cost approx 8K a month! She is a master manipulator and a pathological liar. My younger sister and I have several emails and voice recordings of her abusive behaviour. Just not sure how to proceed with this without her turning our Mother against us. She knows that and uses it against us. This sibling is single has never married no family of her own. She is very self centred and mean to siblings and their spouses and children.
In the words of Morgan Freeman - at first you fight it, then you accept it, then you become institutionalized (Shawshank) I feel this is what is happening to my Mother.
I would never see this sibling again if she wasn't holding my parents captive. My Dad falls constantly and we are called to come get him off the floor before the PSW worker arrives or to help put him to bed every other night since there is no night help available. We are all prisoners of her. She has told my Mother that we only want to put our Dad in a long term home and we want all their money.
Covid is making it a tough decision regarding long term care.
She has been fired from most jobs - worked in HR
She is 61 yrs old my parents are 86 and 87.
Where to go from here??
Good rule of thumb - 'Mind my own business' - https://theartoflivingconsciously.com/minding-your-own-business/
You mention a PSW worker coming in. If there's a suspicion of abuse, they are required to report it. You and your family are not "prisoners" of your sister. She's actually doing you all a favor because she's making your lives possible. She's removing the burden of caregiving from your shoulders and those of your other siblings. It looks to me that the real worry of you and your siblings is that sister at home will get more of your parents money. Well she should if she's the one providing their care 24/7.
"...36K to buy this sibling a new car."
I balked at paying 30K for my new Jeep 2 years ago!! Does she need something that expensive? Would Medicaid agree???
"Apparently due to COVID running a house cost approx 8K a month!"
Good lord... my mom's MC cost just over 8k/month now. IF it cost that much to live in my house, I would be on the street by now, long before now!! I don't have that much income! BTW, my house still has a mtg on it, but expenses are no where near 8k! Must be Buckingham Palace, or a leaky place that is a b*tch to heat!!!
In addition, if this sibling is the care-giver, doing all the "heavy" work, why this:
"My Dad falls constantly and we are called to come get him off the floor before the PSW worker arrives..."
If sibling can't get dad off the floor, she isn't a very good as a care-giver.
"...or to help put him to bed every other night since there is no night help available."
So OP and other sibs ARE contributing to the care-giving as well... Hmmm, maybe they deserve a new car too...
You say when dad falls, you go other there to get him in bed before PSW arrives? Are you saying you do it before other help arrives or you do it so no one will know he fell?
I suggest you and the other sibling(s) go talk with an elder attorney to see about more than one person to oversee the monthly bills, expenses, and to avoid any more major purchases. Without hearing the other side of the story, this could be elder abuse by way of verbal abuse and taking advantage of the finances. If they run out of money, if sibling is as bad as you say, you and other family members are going to end up having to pay for parent's care while a penalty period plays out (period of time where Medicaid will not pay for the bed).
If you feel like a prisoner, it's time to buy a hacksaw and cut through the prison walls.
As long as your Mom and Dad has chosen your sister, there is absolutely nothing you can do about it.
Im sure your parents are happier where they are and not put in a home.
Horange a Caregiver for one person 24 7 cost up to $1,000 a week.
What you can do is only show up to visit or take them out to eat, ect.
When someone falls, call 911.
If other help is needed then your mom can request your sister to do so.
Just FYI go onto to get an idea of what live in caregivers get in your area for 2 people. This always includes room and board. If they are expected to drive to doctors etc then a car is provided. If they have their own car then an additional car expense will be charged. Hope this helps. It is very hard when parents are aging and siblings don’t get along. Painful. Sorry for you all and wish you well.
Out of her 4 children I took care of my mother all by myself for 14 months. Actually for years I'd come over at her beck n call to do everything she told (not asked) me to do with no consideration for my own life. It was declined cognitive issues that forced the 24/7. I wish I'd just put her in nursing care from the start. But I couldn't abandon my own mother. Albeit with a full family in tow. Yes we lived there because every.single.time we left she'd purposely fall so I'd get a call from her neighbor stating I need to hurry back. 911 always had to be called to pick her up but she wanted ME to pick her up.
Let me tell you. It was EMS who freed me up. After weekly calls they told me enough is enough. I shouldn't be doing this alone. My mom fought but it saved my life. My kids and spouse didn't have me.
Perhaps your mom is bribing your sister to stay. Perhaps your sister is lashing out because she's dying inside. She absolutely deserves free rent because she's incarcerated. I absolutely said that. 24/7 her life belongs to not one but two people. She's not able to enjoy a relationship or children because she hasn't a life of her own.
What are you all doing besides complaining? Perhaps one of you could assist in buying your parents stuff. Calling the Drs and making appts or asking questions. Anything besides sit and complain.
Your sister absolutely deserves a new car. She's driving everywhere for everyone else. She's not able to get her own place. How else is she to have a roof when she's caring 24/7 for parents. There is no such compensation appropriate for giving one's life LITERALLY to help others to hang on a bit longer while you give away your chance to experience life at all.
Something to be considered! All the best!
Jubs and prayers
given that this is your sibling and in most sibling relationships there isn’t an “angel” and a “devil”. We don’t know what her version would be, I think it’s fair to assume that if she were here we’d here some very different things that have taken place. Did both your parents have severe out of their mind dementia when they chose her to have poa? If not they had their reasons to choose her for this position - for all we know it could be they chose her bc they feel like she’s the one they feel most comfortable and trusting of the role, and it makes you upset they chose her for that.
Sometimes when one person says another person is being manipulated by another it’s bc they just plain don’t like the person ( in this case your sister) having favor with them. Often divorced couples will claim the reason the kid prefers to stay w one parent is bc they’re “manipulating them”. Sometimes with a kid thats the case, not always. Also after a relationship breakup one partner can’t accept the other one being with someone else and will feel better to describe it as they are manipulated by said person. Unless both your parents have had serious dementia for many years the most likely reason they support your sister in certain ways and chose her as poa is bc they had reasons they felt best about that. Is it possible what she said is true? Yes, it’s possible- doesn’t mean it is, but it could be.
You sound like your painting her being single and not having chosen to have kids as somehow a mark against her. Why would you judge someone for being single and child free? It’s a choice ( believe it or not) that more and more people do. My siblings ex was an amazing woman, genuine kind and highly intelligent and ambitious woman who didn’t want to be married, she also didn’t want kids. I knew another acquaintance who for different but equally valid reasons didn’t either. Stop judging people for not having the exact lifestyle you do.
The verbal abuse are you trying to say this is a “angel” “devil” scenario where you are kind and communicative and she lashes out calling names? I tend to doubt it. I don’t believe she’s the devil you portray anymore than I believe your a victim. I think you both have made different choices and it sounds like there’s a resentment/ envy on your part that parents chose her as poa. Same as with a divorcing couple even if the person is a friend of mine I take it with a grain of salt in any narrative of “what happened “—- usually not an angel and a devil- often more truth lays in the middle.
in any case your parents aren’t out of their mind, their not being held at gunpoint. I don’t see any hostages here. I see a sibling who’s upset her sister has poa and feels like she’s the one who’s easiest to blame
If the sibling has POA that makes it tough.
If you cannot get the parents to reverse this your only option is legal. You need to consult an attorney.
These things get MESSY and expensive
One doesn't realize what you're getting with a live in sibling as care giver. I found out the last week when the brothers elected home healthcare contracting for hospice week. $ 20/hour for 24 hours of care. $ 480/day, $ 3,360/week, $ 174,720/year x 2 years in my case ($ 349,440). Home Healthcare does less than what I did. I also was the pet sitter for the dog's end of life. Caregivers can be victims of the rest of the family trying to do end of life for cheap. I lost them both within 21 days of each other. Mom passed 5 years earlier. I found out how greedy or cheap depending upon one's perspective the other's were in my family. Also how selfish. See Mom & Dad were capable when they took their turns to be close by. I got the last couple of years. The last ditch efforts of hospital procedures, the code Browns. It's a thankless job being a caregiver & home health bundled. I never was compensated beyond what I was gonna get as beneficiary any way. I have no sour grapes, for Dad & dog I'd do it the same way, wouldn't change the terms. Some aren't like me though. What I'd change about it, the rest of the world, the human race has a lot of people that when the rubber meets the road are FOS for what they'd actually commit to the effort and aftermath. That's OK, rewards are on the other side. Life on this side is finite, afterlife for lack of a better description is for eternity, unless there is a reincarnation as a blade of grass or whatever our ashes or bodies fertilize ?
Of a caregiver. Its also typically for other siblings to looked at the caregiver as a freeloader and to be inconsiderate. This is soo unfair. I am glad you came to this group and hope you will see everything for what it is. If you had the responsibilities you sister has you will get fire from your job, will lose your own family and will be looked at thw same way. The court/Judges are aware of this dynamic. I will advise you to get more involve in helping out with your parents, weekends. My dementia MIL ill monthlt expenses to care for her alone is close to what she is spending. My husband and I took care of her for 3 yrs, we almost lost our careers and marriage while the oher siblings were going on with their lives. We did not ask for it. Now, we all pay for her care , and time spent in care is split equally.
Seriously, each family's situation is different, so although what you've described may indeed be the situation here as well, there is also the possibility FEDUP19's situation can't be summed up that way and there is a legitimate cause for concern. FEDUP19 has mentioned several things that are "red flags".
Just a friendly suggestion that it's never a good idea to assume anything!
Do you have any concrete proof that sibling is taking what she wants? As others noted, being POA means one should be managing the finances responsibly, as if she WERE your parents. Just thinking or surmising that sibling is taking too much from mom and dad isn't enough! But if you are certain, there are ways to deal with it. There are plenty of instances when this IS indeed what happens, but it doesn't mean we should lay down and accept it. If you are certain, I would pursue it legally.
The other side of this is if sibling is taking from them and they end up destitute, with the house being sold, etc, Medicaid will do a 5 year lookback and large sums of money going into a black hole will raise flags! They could be denied financial assistance. Not only could they lose liquid assets and the house, but they would end up homeless too.
Consult with Elder Law attys would be a start. Often they will offer a limited initial free consult. Payment should come from their assets, but you don't have access to that, yet. Given good solid input about finances, they might be able to start investigating where all the assets are going and might be able to get guardianship appointed, at least for your father. If mom is deemed competent, there's not a whole lot you can do, but leave that to the "expertise" of the attys.
As someone else noted, you could request becoming rep payee for SS. As VeronicaJo noted, SS does NOT recognize POAs. Two of us were joint on mom's account (it was before dementia and it is what SHE wanted to do.) When I took over her finances, I was using that account to make payments for her. None for me! Because we eventually moved her to MC, the only way I could change the address for SS docs (W2, other notices) was to become rep payee. No federal entity honors ANY POAs and federal mail cannot be forwarded. ALL the paperwork stresses that NO ONE is legally allowed to "manage" anyone else's SS payments. NO ONE. They require that someone sign up as rep payee, to manage the SS monies. They don't consider paying bills with their SS funds legal otherwise.
Call your local SS office to make an appt (vs the 800 # - better response time!) You can make the request(s) and answer all their questions. NOTE: IF you do go this route, do know that both you and your parent(s) will receive notification of the request, which will make them AND sibling aware of the attempt as well. They can contact SS and refuse to allow it (at least mom could.) If your sister does this as your mother, it is illegal.
Be prepared for back-lash. If approved, the first payment will arrive as a check and you can then open a special rep payee account. Once open, call the local office again to start electronic payments. NO ONE, not the person, care-giver, other family member or friend will have access to this account, ONLY the rep payee - yes, you have to report at year end how the funds were used and/or saved for the person. If you use a bill payer or a debit card for everything, you have record, but keep receipts and keep track of all that is paid via this account. The report does lump some categories together, but the form is fairly simple and can be done online (using you own SS account for login.) Receipts should be retained if any questions arise.
At the very least, you might be able to take over your dad's SS. During the application, try to stress that the funds might be misused if left alone. If he has other income, you would have to contact them to discuss what can be done legally. Mom may be more difficult, if she is deemed competent. If there are assets or other sources of income, the Elder Law atty would be the best place to start. They may be able to request audits and perhaps initiate guardianship (overrides any POAs.) They may be able to preserve what they have left and they may be able to bring charges up on sibling, should you deem that appropriate.
Whose decision is it for medical decision-making and care? What level of care are each in need of? 8k a month is what would be paid to a nursing home instead of your sibling who is providing care at home, during covid which mostly likely would restrict visits at a facility. If home care providers would replace your sibling, how much would that be? As poa, sister may be spending down as part of medicaid planning.
These are some of the considerations that should be discussed within some form of mediation.
I've been on the rumors and accusations side and likewise have speculated ... and found it best to let the emotions take a rest and find some objective ground. Easier said than done of course. In the end, you are family.
What we did do was my husband went to Social Security and became her representative payee (social security doesn’t recognize a POA) and transferred this, her CDs, and her pension to a separate bank account the brother could not access. We then petitioned the court for both Guardianship and Conservatorship. It helped a little that my husband was already the designated trustee for the estate so he had access to all the financial records showing fraud but the best thing we did was consult the elder attorney. It wasn’t cheap, and we have to report to the court (and social security) annually on how her money is being spent, but it was the only way we could break the POA. The whole process took about six months, especially since Covid has affected the court system. We were also fortunate the brother chose not to fight us. Had he done so, the guardianship would have been far more expensive.
So the sibling who was basically committing elder abuse & who knows what other financial crimes didn’t want to fight you guys in court, no surprise there. He should have been prosecuted imo but I understand the challenges there too.
Curious, were you able to force him out of the home?
First of all, while your Father has dementia, your mother does NOT. She apparently wants the sister living there, to help with father and all else. The Sister is first of all POA. I don't know how you know exactly the arrangement on the accounts, but the sister will be managing finances apparently for your parents. While she doesn't owe you any explanations, she is responsible for keeping meticulous records. If a lawyer suggests APS be called to check on any accusations of financial embezzlement then I would follow that recommendation.
You understand that we have "your side" in this. I can imagine a "Sister story" here of "I have moved in with my parents to care for them at my Mother's request and I am acting as the FPOA with little to no help from my siblings, and nothing but interference and accusations. What can I do about this?"
So as you can see, we cannot know the real story, and you yourselves may not know the real story. If you suggest abuse you should ALL go to a Lawyer with all evidence including recordings, and find out how to proceed.
Do know that fights in court between siblings often have the court taking over guardianship, and removing all siblings entirely. At that point ALL siblings have nothing whatsoever to say about things ongoing. And if you bring court actions, and your Mom says that her life is proceeding as she wishes, you may be paying all lawyer costs.
You might go to Mediate.com and look up family mediation resources before you take action.