He says it wont be ideal but we won't have a choice because how else will he pay his bills if I'm not helping him. I told him to sell the business and pay off the house and he said then I won't have anything to do so you will still have to move in. He doesn't have enough bedrooms for one and two, he can be extremely demanding of my time and energy as it is. He gets so emotional when I tell him no, so something like this how do I adress it? He says he'd rather commit suicide than move into an apartment that's based on income. My 13 year old son has already told me if I move in with him he is going to live with his dad and I can't have that! My kids come first. This is so much anxiety.
Repeat as required. If he tells you that he would rather commit suicide tell him that it sounds like he has a plan and disconnect the phone or walk away, that is manipulation and it should be called and never entertained.
Stick to your guns, your children are your responsibility not your childish dad.
You are not responsible for Dad. He is being emotionally abusive and you need to call him on it.
When he gets emotional, tell him sorry Dad but you have to find another way. I will not move in with you, and you cannot move in with me. Then hang up, walk away, disconnect from the conversation.
If possible check out therapy to help you deal with Dad and reinforce to your son that he comes first.
In my personal experience men who have poor coping skills will threaten suicide to get their way. My response to that threat is, I will call 911. If they mean it, they need mental health help. If they are bluffing you are calling their bluff and they will have to explain themselves to the authorities. Here when there is a 911 call regarding suicide attempts or threats, the police attend with the ambulance service.
Remind him that you are in that spot now. You have children of your own to take care of and that’s your priority. He’s a young man relatively speaking. You will have plenty of time to pay him back when he’s in his Mid 80s to late 90s in helping him manage his finances and health care. Careful not to make promises you can’t keep about moving in etc.
You could be with him 30 yrs if you moved in with him now.
I want to second the suggestion that you seek therapy.
Your son at 13 threatening you he will leave is not a good dynamic. Not for him or your household.
Fingers crossed dad’s business picks up.
Threatening suicide is a common way for people to manipulate others. Call he cops if he threatens it, and do not move in with him under any circumstances. He is using emotional blackmail, a very common abusive behaviour; and a GIGANTIC red flag that you must NOT move in with him. If he is abusing you now, it will get far worse if you live with him.
His failure to plan ahead for his own future is not your problem.
Your first duty is to your children. I'm glad to see your son realizes this is a mistake giving into your father's demand. Keep repeating to him that moving in with him just won't work for you. So he gets emotional, so he gets mad. So what? (and if he threatens suicide, call 911..common tactic among seniors trying to get their own way)You can't live your life worried he will be mad at you. He can sell his business, find cheaper accommodations an find something else to keep him busy. None of this should involve you moving in with him.
You need to set boundries now. Start little steps. The first being, "Dad, I will say this one more time, moving in with you or you with me is not going to happen. You need to get that out of your mind and start thinking of other options". If he sells the business and pays off the house he should have more money to live on. He now has to adjust to his circumstances. Hopefully, he will except that. Then you work on him expecting you to be there. Explain that you have 2 kids and a job. You only have so many hours in the day. Ten go to getting ready for work, commute and 8 1/2 hours of work. Then you come home to two children who need to be fed and probably are in extra curricular activities. After doing all that, its time for bed and the next day it starts all over again. You don't have time to be at his beck and call. At 71 if he has a business, he is capable of caring for himself. Not saying you shouldn't make time for him, maybe Sunday lunch out. Invite him for dinner but you do him no favor doing things for him. Your not his wife, your his daughter.
Your father is not old and he is being abusive and cruel. Growing up with a mother who threatened suicide almost daily as a way to 'control us'--that's a terrible thing to do. It affected me severely...and only until I was in my 30's did I stop feeling responsible for making her happy.
Your son at 13 is wiser that was I.
Dad is not old, not by a long shot and he can figure out his own life. Ruining yours and your kids' isn't the answer.
Good Luck. And maybe tell him that threatening to 'off' himself to get your attention is harmful to your kids' mental wellbeing.
No is a complete sentence. Let your father know that under NO circumstances will you and your children be moving in with him, that scenario just does not work for you. Period. Allow him to make other arrangements for his future and understand that you will NOT be his safety net here.
Otherwise, prepare to give up your life & your children's lives to your father's whims and desires.
Nip this nonsense in the bud NOW, before your anxiety gets SO bad that you cave in to his demands!
Good luck!
I've helped my children financially and in many other ways, beyond normal parenthood. I did it voluntarily not expecting anything in return but gratitude and for my kids to not squander those opportunities and blessings. Your dad is in panic mode and can't make rational decisions, it seems. This is not your problem and you can't solve it for him. He is like a drowning person flailing his arms in terror and if you swim near him he will grab you and you will both drown. Don't let him move in. This is unsustainable. Do not lend him money (that's what banks are for). If he's maxxed out on loans, all the more reason not to touch it with a 10-foot pole. Neither are you responsible for his happiness. Much good wisdom and thoughts were provided. Please heed them. Unfortunately your father is a manipulative person. It's down right cruel for him to give you that horrible ultimatum of moving in or suicide. You can certainly help him in other ways, like pointing him to outside resources like if there is any free accounting help for small business owners from the Small Business Administration. Why didn't he apply for the PPP loan help from the government? We did. We're only 6 people. Also, what kind of business does he own? I get that you feel like you should help him because he helped you, but not in this situation. His business sounds like a black hole for money and he doesn't know boundaries. It is ok to put up boundaries for yourself. He's an adult and should be able to figure this out without dragging you into it. Maybe he can find a renter to help pay his mortgage (if he has one) or a subtenant for his business (we did this). I can only imagine the emotional stress and guilt you may be feeling, but covid lockdown did expose all the businesses that were already shaky, and his was one of them. I wish you all the best and peace in your heart that it is ok to keep a healthy distance.
What's natural is you raise your kids to be independent. You may help them with College but at 18 they, in the eyes of the law, are emancipated adults. This is when you let them go to live their own lives (even if they still live home) and you start a new faze in your life. You do not cling to your children. Does Dad come from a different culture? Because how he thinks is not normal. Not that you can't be there for him, but he should not be relying on you. If he cannot afford to pay the mortgage, then maybe selling the house, paying off the balance of the mortgage and using the proceeds to offset the cost of an apartment is a better choice. No taxes, no house insurance, water/sewer bills. No upkeep. Just rent, electric and cable.
If you don't continue to set boundries, its going to get harder and harder to deal with him. He gets older, so do you. At a point you will both be Seniors. He has to let you live your life like he was allowed to live his. If he is not being treated for his depression, he needs to be. If he is being treated, I may tell the doctor what has been going on. If Moms death is recent, maybe he needs grief counseling.
Sorry if this sounds harsh, I apologize in advance. The only way Dad could know about your finances is if you have mentioned them. If he asks, tell him not to worry you r doing OK. Its none of his business what your finances are. As it is none of yours what his are unless he tells you. I didn't know my Moms until I started paying her bills.
Keep strong. Hopefully eventually he will realize its his responsibility for his own life. He is not too old to remarry. 😊
Be strong and be firm and inform Dad that your obligation is to your kids, and that even WITHOUT that you may not choose to live with him or with anyone else, and when you do CHOOSE to live with someone it will be YOUR choice, not his. That you are grown up now, and make your own choices. That you have REAL LIMITATIONS, and one of those limitations is that you do not wish to live with your father, now or in future. Be firm and gentle. Tell him that this option for him is now laid to rest, off the menu, and this will help him to rethink and replan moving forward.
Fast forward 3 years and FIL is 100% dependent on them. Their son moved out (but he was old enough to live on his own). She spends her days, every day, on the razor's edge. Emotional and possible physical abuse as kids has kept her and my H "in line" for many years. He is antagonistic and mean. Manipulative and uses guilt like a finely honed weapon.
He too refuses to socialize with anyone outside of the family. He makes vague threats about how dying would be easier. And he is a huge narcissist and everyone in nursing home/AL care is old and he's not (86).
Please don't let him convince you that this is reasonable. I promise you if my SIL could go back in time, they would have found ANY option besides living with him. And once you are living together it is a million times harder to get out. The emotional and mental toll it could potentially take is scary. And you are right, anything you've borrowed from him in the past, though most rational people wouldn't, if he sees it as a way to keep you in line, he'll use it. And you are likely primed for the guilt reaction whether you even know it deep down yet. I begged my SIL not to give in and set boundaries and now it's pretty much too late. Because once you do it one time, for people predisposed to control, they will expect that it is now your job. Set those boundaries. It doesn't mean you don't love him. It means you love yourself and your own family enough to put up perfectly healthy boundaries to protect the relationship.