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Ask Sue 19?? . She posts sometimes on the “what’s for Dinner?” thread. She is a nurse, Mexican husband and lives in Mexico, works in US. She might offer some good insight.
[Sorry - this was meant to be continuing the conversation with needtowashhair but I've put it in the wrong bit and can't seem to move it.]
Well...
We, and by "we" I mean Western societies taken as a broad sweep, do care; but we care in radically different ways.
Btw, the cost of living in Tokyo is among the highest in the world. Prices are dizzying.
I can't remember if it was George Mikes or another commentator who observed that we in the West operate a guilt culture, whereas Japan is the supreme example of the Eastern shame culture.
A Japanese elder is ashamed to accept being helpless. That is why you observe even the oldest and most frail of those residents trying hard to maintain personal standards in all things, from bowing (when they really can't bend much at all) to showing appreciation of little quips about their beaux. You may also have seen tv footage of the Fukushima rescue, when memorably a very elderly lady, carried out on a stretcher, was still attempting to rise and bow to thank her rescuers.
If you were managing a facility full of Japanese elders your difficulties with compliance and challenging behaviours would pretty much vanish. [I don't know if this is true but I would certainly be interested to learn whether the sheer depth of ingrained social training even masks dementia for much longer]. But if you were a resident, and expected to care deeply, to your very soul, about maintaining standards of etiquette, personal hygiene and grooming, willingness always to join in and try your best no matter what your infirmities... you would think you had died and gone to eternal boot camp.
Or, if you were managing a facility staffed by Japanese CNAs, your staff turnover, absenteeism and discipline issues similarly would be no more. But if you worked there, and found that your coworkers were genuinely shocked and appalled by your pathetic failure to live and breathe the facility's corporate culture 100% at all times, including when asleep, you would long to feel annoyed by Western idleness and cynicism (as long as the job still gets done somehow, kind of).
So, lack the will? We lack the entire mindset. We lack the minutely defined rules of life and society. There are compensations, such as freedom of expression and individual choice; but those are perhaps not so helpful if you're trying to run an excellent facility.
I've thought about the same if it ever comes to that. I've seen some videos on youtube about Mexican facilities and the quality seems pretty high especially considering the greatly lower cost.
I wish we had access to Japanese nursing homes. Check this place out. It costs about $25K a year. Which is high for Japan since it's a private facility. If Japan can do it, why can't the United States?
Because you are not Japanese, and neither are your elders :)
I too greatly admire much of what I saw, and thank you for the link, but we would not last five minutes in that place either as a staff member or as a resident. We would get expelled for being dangerous subversives.
I am a foreigner, so forgive me if I am not putting this as tactfully as I should; but does your mother or the rest of your family have any connections in Mexico?
If your brother's idea is to find the best environment for your mother's sense of security and wellbeing, that's one thing.
If this is a cost saving exercise, but the placement will put your mother out of practical reach for visiting, then... :(
What has your brother said about the plan, exactly? What's his reasoning?
Many Americans do it. It's Mexico and not TImbuktu. I know many Americans have a image of Mexico that's not too kind. Fortunately, that image is unfounded.
There are large American expat communities all over Mexico. From safety to quality of life many find it refreshing compared to the US. But if getting back to the US is of concern, there are plenty of Mexican Nursing Homes along the border that cater to Americans. Here's one close to San Diego. If needed you can get back a San Diego hospital in short order. 21 miles and 38 minutes to be back in the heart of San Diego according to google. That's better than being in some areas of the US to get to a major hospital. This news story is about a San Diego nurse who put her mom in a Mexican nursing home. As you can see, the staff speaks perfect English and many of the residents are American.
A current news story about Mexico hospital and care there. Google firefighter in Mexico hospital. I sure wouldn't consider placing a loved one in Mexico based on what this story states, and there was a wife advocating for her husband. They still had tremendous difficulty.
And from your profile mom has dementia and already in a nursing home. Leave her be. A move to Mexico at this point would cause a tremendous decline that she may not recover from. She passes there. Then what?
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
Well...
We, and by "we" I mean Western societies taken as a broad sweep, do care; but we care in radically different ways.
Btw, the cost of living in Tokyo is among the highest in the world. Prices are dizzying.
I can't remember if it was George Mikes or another commentator who observed that we in the West operate a guilt culture, whereas Japan is the supreme example of the Eastern shame culture.
A Japanese elder is ashamed to accept being helpless. That is why you observe even the oldest and most frail of those residents trying hard to maintain personal standards in all things, from bowing (when they really can't bend much at all) to showing appreciation of little quips about their beaux. You may also have seen tv footage of the Fukushima rescue, when memorably a very elderly lady, carried out on a stretcher, was still attempting to rise and bow to thank her rescuers.
If you were managing a facility full of Japanese elders your difficulties with compliance and challenging behaviours would pretty much vanish. [I don't know if this is true but I would certainly be interested to learn whether the sheer depth of ingrained social training even masks dementia for much longer]. But if you were a resident, and expected to care deeply, to your very soul, about maintaining standards of etiquette, personal hygiene and grooming, willingness always to join in and try your best no matter what your infirmities... you would think you had died and gone to eternal boot camp.
Or, if you were managing a facility staffed by Japanese CNAs, your staff turnover, absenteeism and discipline issues similarly would be no more. But if you worked there, and found that your coworkers were genuinely shocked and appalled by your pathetic failure to live and breathe the facility's corporate culture 100% at all times, including when asleep, you would long to feel annoyed by Western idleness and cynicism (as long as the job still gets done somehow, kind of).
So, lack the will? We lack the entire mindset. We lack the minutely defined rules of life and society. There are compensations, such as freedom of expression and individual choice; but those are perhaps not so helpful if you're trying to run an excellent facility.
I wish we had access to Japanese nursing homes. Check this place out. It costs about $25K a year. Which is high for Japan since it's a private facility. If Japan can do it, why can't the United States?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf-OBn8Nwko
I too greatly admire much of what I saw, and thank you for the link, but we would not last five minutes in that place either as a staff member or as a resident. We would get expelled for being dangerous subversives.
If your brother's idea is to find the best environment for your mother's sense of security and wellbeing, that's one thing.
If this is a cost saving exercise, but the placement will put your mother out of practical reach for visiting, then... :(
What has your brother said about the plan, exactly? What's his reasoning?
There are large American expat communities all over Mexico. From safety to quality of life many find it refreshing compared to the US. But if getting back to the US is of concern, there are plenty of Mexican Nursing Homes along the border that cater to Americans. Here's one close to San Diego. If needed you can get back a San Diego hospital in short order. 21 miles and 38 minutes to be back in the heart of San Diego according to google. That's better than being in some areas of the US to get to a major hospital. This news story is about a San Diego nurse who put her mom in a Mexican nursing home. As you can see, the staff speaks perfect English and many of the residents are American.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WSdVZjnKQI
And from your profile mom has dementia and already in a nursing home. Leave her be. A move to Mexico at this point would cause a tremendous decline that she may not recover from. She passes there. Then what?