How to hide money to be approved for Medicaid?

Dogabone, must you continue your frickin' rants about recommending that everyone commit fraud to take advantage of government programs....oh, let me replace the word government with taxpayers, as in your fellow posters on this site. Do we have to keep telling others to disregard your wacko advice? Are you serious about keeping cold cash in the freezer? Like no one has ever thought of that before. I worked for the IRS in collections for years. Don't think you can always hide a safe deposit box or prevent access to the contents. With your attitude about cheating I can't imagine who would be comfortable having you as an additional signer on the box. If you know some specific millionaire getting benefits by following your advice I suggest you call them out or turn them in to authorities. Maybe you should look in your aunt's freezer. Maybe that where the cash deposits you take out of her account every day are disappearing to when they've "grown legs" and can't be accounted for.

Well, I never understood the so-called "welfare cheats" until for the first time in my life and family history I had to apply for assistance through the area agency on aging who, by the way, are the gate keepers for all services to seniors in region of my state. Like a fool, I answered all of the income questions truthfully. I am the sole caregiver on the planet earth of my 92 year old mother with moderate level dementia (and progressing). First of all, we are a little under 200.00 over income and therefore, we get virtually no assistance. They determined that we had an 80% co-pay for all caregiver services (home health aid, companion, respite, nursing home care, et al.). As a former teacher (who lost her job due to the amount of time I had to take off, leave early caring for my mother), I pointed out to them that the math did not reconcile. They do not deduct for mortgage, car (necessary to take her anywhere), insurance, food, and the many supplies I have to buy for her care. Their response was "there is nothing we can do, good luck" and this was from different programs administered by the area agency on aging. We do not have the cash that we need for in-home care let alone nursing home care (3,000/month minimum) or any respite for me (150/day minimum). There is a special grant program for nursing home assistance that requires documentation of all income. I can't get the documentation for her pensions beyond social security. I don't know the ID numbers, years, etc and she has dementia. Her other pensions are in another state, and I cannot afford to pay for someone to look after her for a few weeks (or more) while I go to the MI state capital and wade through the bureaucratic nightmare to find documentation and she can't travel. Meanwhile, if she could travel, who would look after her while i went from office to office trying to get the documentation. I too am a senior citizen and had to take my social security early after my unemployment stopped. I have applied for countless jobs, and started many projects that could (under other circumstances) yield some income. But my mother's care is all consuming. I get very little sleep, I have high blood pressure, and diabetes which until a few years ago was under control without medication. Now, for the first time, I have had to take medication. All of the programs helping seniors are based on federal income requirements and all you have to be is one dollar over income. Our circumstances have destroyed my professional and personal life and rendered me financially just above destitute. I have come to the conclusion that the only way for those of us who are not wealthy or have substantial assets; for those of us who have worked all of our lives---I have been paying taxes since I was 13, my mother from 19 to 70---to live as we age is to not age. I have also come to the conclusion that the only way to get any kind of assistance is to know the ins and outs of the system and tell them (the clerks who take the information and the paraprofessional "social workers") only what they need to know to fill out their various forms. That may be why welfare has become a multi-generational process. For one, someone has to teach you what you should and should not say. The program workers are primarily there to screen out people from receiving services and are very cagy about the guidelines. I am stuck living the life of a 92 year old at 63 years old. My last best years are being spent home bound with my mother. My mother is stuck not receiving the care and socialization she needs, because I am always, cooking, cleaning, cleaning up messes, doing social work looking for a way to get her into a nursing home, doing home repairs, trying to manage the money, keeping up with medications, basically running a one-woman nursing home. But someway, I must get a job or generate income of an additional 500./month (minimum) to pay for her nursing home care. While dogabone may have some non-standard ways of dealing with the money, she is giving some advice to those that may be in my situation (before they get in my situation). There is a strong possibility that I will not outlive my mother. (And frankly, after seven years of this, I don't care how it ends; I don't care if I die first, I would at least get some rest. As I have watched my life crumbling to almost nothing, I have really lost the will to live.) However, if I do die first, the state gets to take my home, all of its contents, and my life insurance policy and put what remains after my mother dies in the coffers. In the so-called richest nation in the world it is shameful they way this culture treats the elderly. More people should speak out and share what they know about how to not get railroaded into by the state/government's outrageous rules and regulations that have no bearing on the reality of people's lives

Yemi - if your mom' situation is that her in income is $ 200 over whatever her state has as it's income ceiling for her to qualify for Medicaid (so she is not meeting your state's definition of "impoverished"); then you should look to see if mom can do a Miller Trust or Qualified (Guaranteed) Income Trust to get her income to be within Medicaid guidelines.

Miller is a pretty straightforward legal entity to get those who need Medicaid to pay for NH but just have too much "income" to qualify but not enough "income" to private pay. The NH staff or Area on Aging staff don't mention Miller as it's legal and they are not attorneys. (Here on this site you can pretty much suggest anything….as dog a bone has or as I have for that matter too!). You need an attorney to set it up as it has to be structured for your state laws and flexible/adaptable is mom's income changes. Good luck.

Igloo, thank you for your fair, legal insight. I have learned from you.

Dogabone, you disgust me. Encouraging people to commit fraud and doing so repeatedly is wrong and immoral. I hope you get audited, you have made your lack of ethics clear.
I am proud to pay my taxes, the only thing worst than cheater is a proud cheater that encourages others to cheat along.
I hope AC will wake up and block your from the site for inciting fraud of the US government and taxpayers!

Dog - about the freezer, well Bill Jefferson (former Rep - LA) did that. Didn't work out too well for him but worked out great for the FBI who found it!

Although your rant is interesting theory, it's just not feasible for the elderly to do. Really like those with dementia, cognitive issues and limited health situations can deal with the full-time job of maintaining a gambling facade.

Millionaires on Medicaid!!!??? I doubt that the wealthy are going to lower their standards to end up in a NH sharing a room with the impoverished. But what the truly wealthy do (generationally wealthy) is to grow up planning for the future and are open to having other professionals provide insight. Not hiding away a couple of thousand in the freezer or squirreling away hundred's in a coffee can.

vegaslady and lsmiami you have the right to your own oppinions there's no reason to be so upset over me. I'm not Encouraging people to commit fraud .I'm just speakingout is all. Enough said to ya.

Let's face the truth.If anyone had a chance to be approved for Medicaid to pay for their Medical bills and to keep their life savings for their retirement enjoyment.99.9% will attempt to do it!
I stated before some may differ my opinions it's their right to. I careless personally. As we speak there's Millionairs collecting Medicaid/GOV-Benefits and getting away with it. While the deserving get denied. That's what I stand for is the deserving that's denied .Elderlies are losing their retirements and being forced to conduct spendowns inorder to be approved while the wealthy gain without being pointed towards. Some say, Why not report the Wealthy for GOV-fraud?
Requires proof doesn't it!...If your a Millionair and know how the system works.Your smart enough to do it all correct without a paper trail.Requires knowing how the system works and what they look for.Let's face it,your not gonna tell anyone how you get your grass so green.Doing so will make other's greener then yours.The Main thing that Medicaid looks for is "Gifts by large amounts" as we all know.How to twist that Millionairs know the system.
Is it wrong to tell the people that really need Medicaid how to be approved?Life is a gamble.Fraud you feel?Only if you get cought.Unfare?Yes,it's unfare to the people that really need Medicaid and are denied the free ride while the Rich gain.Is it unfare that your told what you can & what you can't do with your retirement.Did you ever wonder why retirement people move to FLA?It's not for the weather.
I speakout with the truth.I may be wrong by doing so.Shoot me lol.

Yemi, sorry for your situation. It's probably made worse by your feelings of hopelessness and not figuring out how to resolve issues. As to your mom's pensions in other states....how is it that you know enough about it to report the amount of the income it but can't figure out anything else? Instead of traveling, have you heard of writing letters or phone calls? Maybe someone at AARP or the Alzheimer's Assoc could help you. If the money is direct deposited can't you get the information from the bank or the 1099 forms that are sent out at the end of the year? As for yourself, you could probably use an antidepressant and support. Start with your own doctor and ask for help.

In reply to igloo572,(Millionaires on Medicaid!!!??? I doubt that the wealthy are going to lower their standards to end up in a NH sharing a room with the impoverished.)
Is that what you think?You doubt that?Humm..
From your doubts of thinking,you have no idea what medical bills cost in the real world we live in.
I had a Uncle yrs ago with hundreds of thousands of dollars locked tight away.People don't save up for their life's retirements for medical bills.Their thinking is to save to have a good life and enjoyment.My Uncle had cancer.He required to be on in-home oxygen inorder to stay alive.He was paying out of pocket cost over $6,000 per month just for oxygen tanks.He was also,in denial of dieing .He felt at the time he would make thur the fight of cancer.He said manytime to me that he didn't save all his life to pay just for medical bills.With the cost of oxygen his money would have sunk.He was a wealthy person all his life and saved.For him to realize he will be poor by the cost of oxygen he wouldn't go for that!...He knew people that knew people as Millionairs on Medicaid.You say,you doubt that the wealthy are going to lower their standards?Come-on.....Get real...
Millionairs have tight lips and personally careless what people think and they don't tell a sole they take it all to their grave.You doubt ha?So did I at first untill I seen it done for my eyes to see.Do you also,don't doubt people with handicap parking stickers that walk without a limp?Humm.

Your continued encouragement for people to cheat their fellow taxpayers is disgusting, dogabone. What you suggest is against the law. That is not an opinion, it is a fact.

The only people I can think of who would be interested in hiding money to qualify for Medicaid would be the heirs. If the elder is going into a NH, money in the freezer wouldn't be much use to them.

Hi Vagaslady, I am responding to you because I don't think a lot of people know how difficult and sometimes impossible it is to get official information from a government agency. Especially when doing so on behalf of someone else. So this is for others who may read my post as well. One would think that any documentation that implied an automatic payment and which names the source would be adequate documentation. (I always submit bank statements indicating the income information.) But, no. Most of the agencies and programs that offer assistance require a specific document--a benefit verification letter from the source. That being said, getting specific information from a governmental entity is interesting and frustrating. First of all, is navigating the phone prompt or web site options to get to the correct person (and their address) who handles the request. Many want you to make a web-based (not USPS) or an in-person request because they need to verify the validity of the request. Many such agencies do not accept Powers of Attorney and must get the permission directly from the individual at subject. I had to physically take my mother into the social security office for a duplicate card. This was a dangerous activity for someone who is unsteady on her feet, partially blind, and gets really agitated and really confused when anything changes in her routine. I had to physically drive to Ohio, get someone to look after Mom for two days to get her birth certificate. The web-based request kept rejecting me because I did not know the name of hospital where she was born. (Meanwhile in 1923, many people were born at home.) The person on the phone kept insisting that I could submit an online request. I do not have the funds to travel and pay someone over $100/day for an open ended time to get the information from the state's HR department and whose to say that I will be able to accomplish that without bringing her. She simply cannot travel that long, walk from a car to the office. Although I am getting a wheel chair, the change in environment alone would agitate, frighten, and disorient her and she would be unable to coherently answer questions. They would perhaps, having her in person accept her request to have me represent her--a kind of in-person Power of Attorney. I have been in search of a private social worker who specialized in geriatrics since 2007. The Alzheimer's Assn. was sending me a list since last month so I must keep on them and I'm awaiting a call back from Monday---task #3,692 to remember and do. This is a societal and social policy problem that I am sure affects others. The social policies (rules, regulations/documentation requirements) do not reflect the facts on the ground. Personally, using brain medicine (as my Dr. referred to antidepressants) to medicate away my emotions does not help. Tried that with three different Rx's and after two years I developed dangerous side effects. I try for meditation, talk therapy, and as many positive self-help books and apps I can get my hands on. Yet, going down one blind alley to meet a brick wall is still the stark reality--bleak is bleak; I fight daily (and sometime moment-by-moment) to think positively and optimistically. Moreover, the demands of our circumstances require that I have a lot energy to run the NH and most of my wits about me. Again, I post this because I genuinely believe that this is a social policy and a social values and perceptions problem in the US regarding aging. Someone on the ground so-to-speak must shed light on what goes on in practice with the state of assistance for the elderly who have worked their adult lives and are not absolutely destitute.

Hi Igloo572, Thank you so much for the information on the Miller Trust/Qualified Income Trust!!! I did not know they existed (not even the Senior Law Project attorney mentioned this when I asked about setting up a trust to care for my mother upon my death). I will look this up immediately. I usually use an online legal form and have it reviewed by a and then an attorney to cut down on overall legal fees. Again, Thank You So Much!! :)

Gosh Yemi, in 7 years you haven't found a social worker? Hmmm. Can't you write to the state HR dept and just ask for a duplicate award letter? You prepare it and have your mother sign it. I didn't understand about having to run the NH. It sounds like you need assistance to get things done. Hopefully this will happen soon for you.

As we have learned with LO with dementia, it does no good to try and be rational and carry on a logical conversation. So goes it with Dogabone.

I think that's enough said about Dogabone, if anyone new came to AC right now, right here on this thread, they would not return with the statements you make about her. She believes what she believes, and I think in her own way is trying to help someone out there who does not want to give every penny they worked for all their lives to the "takers" I know personally an older man who owned a fleet of taxi cabs in DC, also a millionaire, receiving the highest amount of Social Security also. Dementia hit, but he had the foresight to manage much of his money, but guess what, wifey stuck him in a NH, yes sharing a room until he passed on, like she said, he has no clue who he is now and rather enjoys the company. Just saying let's be a little kinder to each other, remember we are here for a reason, just keeping our heads above water every day is a daunting task.

To Dogabone about the being able to give $10,000 to family members, my neighbors brother recently passed away ALZ, years ago he put everything he had in the brothers and his uncles name/accounts & it worked for him. Medicaid paid for all his time in NH, I don't think that's ripping off anybody, ripping off is us taxpayers paying every waking hour for those phonies out there collecting welfare, food stamps, cell phones & yes misusing Handicapped Placards on their rear view mirrors, where there's a will there's a way. Hang in there

Gosh I'm sick of the excuse "well other people do it" when justifying illegal behavior.

back in 2009, I had breast cancer. I was $50 over the limit for Medicaid. I took a day off from work so I could qualify. I didn't do the followup treatment because I didn't want to continue trying to qualify for Medicaid. (and I didn't want to deal with the treatments anymore)

twopupsmom...oh the placard thing...I have one for my mother. I would be scared to use it without her in the car for fear of karma catching up with me!

wanting, my thoughts exactly, we don't have one, could get one but why for the convenience of parking really close to the store, the exercise is good - and there aren't that many spaces so why would I want to take one when the guy in back of me has a van with a wheelchair lift. Some states have laws on this - if your driving info does not match the number on that handicapped parking card, and you have no one you are waiting for that it belongs to, $500 fine.

Not all handicapped people walk with a limp. My handicap is not visible, and I don't usually require a wheelchair, but I do have a handicap sticker. There are many conditions that qualify for one, including heart and lung conditions, chronic pain conditions and many others that may not lead to a limp.

Thank you for your comment eguillot. I was going to make the same comment but it is stronger from a person with personal experience.

equillot, oh I agree. My mother has COPD and a heart condition. I was just talking about people that have the placard for family members using the cards when they are alone. To me, that is inviting karma to give you a quick kick in the butt. I use it when I have mom with me but can't bring myself to try to cheat no matter how tired or how crowded the parking lot is when I am alone.

Most of the time, even though I have a handicapped sticker, I don't use the handicapped spots unless I'm having a bad day. I try to walk on those days I can. On the days I can't, I use the parking spaces.

I had to give explainations about any transaction of $1,000.00 or greater that was not for medical or housing. Also, I had to show receipts for the medicaid appplication. In NJ there is a penalty for gifting your children within five years of application. For 2013, my Mom's nursing home costs were over 125,000.00. Her tax refund is $599.00. I wish I knew how to hide the money. My Mom paid taxes for 70 years. She does not get a dime from the government.

not disputing anyone that uses one, I'm not here to judge, I live near a major city, a friend of mine, an elderly lawyer had 4 stolen from the rear view mirror at his office in downtown, now we are talking breaking the entire window to pieces to get them, going rate on the streets $50.00, think we are getting off subject here.

Encouraging people to hide money in order to quality for Medicaid disgusts me! People like this is wasting OUR money. Those who are in dire need of care don't get coverage from government programs while some people cheat and take advantage of Medicaid. If you don't want to spend down your assets and still receive benefits from Medicaid then why not buy partnership policy in your state.

This is the legal way to protect your assets and still qualify for Medicaid. Let's not patronize this person's suggestion and let's do the right thing.

About Millionaires & Medicaid, I seem to remember years back, where Joe Kennedy (Total assets on paper) at his death, amounted to $500. what say again about Millionaires?

My parents raised me to be an honest person. They taught me to not cheat on my taxes, to never steal, and if someone dropped a $20 bill, to pick it up and give it to them. If an ATM spits out too much cash, I give it back to the bank. Why? Because it's the right thing to do. There is a thing called honor and integrity, and that is something that my parents taught me was more important than any amount of money. Treat other people with honesty and respect, and expect the same, no less , in return.

In financial matters, my parents were private. They didn't go around telling people how much money they had, showing off what they had, or complaining when times were tough. And there were plenty of times when things were tough. But we got through it. It wasn't until after Dad retired that we learned that Dad had done very well for himself. Well enough to set up a trust. Yes, a nursing home could be very expensive, and could eat up most of the assets of the trust that my father set up. However, trying to hide those assets would go against everything he believed in.

We will continue to keep caring for Mom at home as long as we can. We'll get caregivers to come into the home to do what my husband and I can't do (he's retired now, too, so that takes a lot of the burden off me). If need be we'll get her a hospital bed. Her bathroom is already perfect for her. We have tv's in every room, no stairs, a nice outdoor patio and we can drive her anywhere she wants to go. We will minimize, as much as possible, the cost to the estate of her care. If that is not possible, if her care gets to be too much, so be it. We will have tried.

Arrow1 - I just read up on Joseph Kennedy - his assets upon his death were $500 - MILLION. I thought that sounded wrong. Everything was in trusts by then, but the trusts are one of the biggest money makers for the Kennedy clan.

No Kennedy ever got dumped onto Medicaid, not even the daughter that Joe had lobotomized to control her disobedience. The procedure reduced the young woman to infantile status.