Can my sister come after us for financial assistance for Mom?

Moms1of6. As the caregiver with a sister who does absolutely nothing but hold out her hand to take what she can from our elderly mother with dementia I am questioning your post. We really are not seeing a full picture of the situation to make more than what we know to be the legal statements.

From my situation with my sister she will never help monetarily or would I expect it since I know she only takes and never gives.(Not even a birthday or Christmas present for Mom which could be home made or dollar store. It's just the thought) I would love to hear her just once say she would come and stay with our mother for a week so my hubby and I could go off fishing for some down time. We have been caring for mom for the last 7 years this time. We did care when mom went through cancer treatmets for a couple of years with a 5 yr break until the stroke. I receive not so much as thought from thought other than comments regarding her inheritance, which I have pointed out isn't an inheritance until a person dies. I am keeping very good financial records of expenses that I have paid for on my own dime so that at the time we are settling the "inheritance" I will be reimbursed. (Things like property taxes on mom's house, Rx costs that are not covered by insurance and in the hundreds of dollars, etc.) This may turn into my sister owing me for her half of the expenses out of her "inheritance" . I will be more than happy to set up a payment plan since I doubt there will be much of anything left in the end. I didn't really consider keep track until my mother's elder attorney told me to since she knows my sister and our situation.

We could all give you a better evaluation of your situation if you could give us better details and not be one sided to color the situation.

I think everyone is being too harsh and without knowing all of the details. This doesn't add up because moms1of6 was going to mother's house, I'm assuming, to assist until she was asked to stop. Was it because there was lack of dementia experience that was causing stress? Or was it because the dementia patient has been manipulated? Or was it because, through no fault of her own, the poor lady now has this response to her daughter? Either way, I would be very concerned about how money is being used to care for the dementia patient (Social Security or any other assets). We have experienced or read on this website how many times the elderly person's money has been used for something other than their care. Personally, I made that information transparent to my sibling when I cared for my grandmother. The password information for the bank accounts that took care of my grandmother was given to my sister to review and question as she liked.

Shame on you. Unless you are destitute, what is your reason for providing no help? If you are worried that contributions towards your mother's care may not be used for that purpose, then offer to pay for something directly. If you are not financially able, then do something else to help! If there are hideous family dynamics at play, then you still need to do something else. First of all, when your mother is gone, you will never forgive yourself for not stepping up. Second, caregiving is HARD WORK. Cut your sister some slack. But don't let her continue to cut you out of your mother's life--unless that's what you want. Otherwise promise that you will work to have a peaceful visit that will not upset her. But if you really truly don't care about your mom or your sister, and know for certain that you will have no regrets once your mom is gone and you have no relationship w/your sister left, then you are dong the right thing.

First and foremost, if diagnosed with dementia, one does not get better, at least in the later stages. This is a terminal diagnosis. Secondly, no one can "make" you pay for your mother's care, unless perhaps you are holding property of your mother's and there is a legally binding contract. If your mother does not want to see you, then write her your thoughts as a letter will not aggravate Crohn's, and accept the fact you probably won't get to see her in the future. It is sad that family relationships are not like they are on television, but usually they are not as witnessed by the recent kicking incident in the elevator of Beyoncé's sister. Just hold your head high and love your mother through your letters/cards if you choose. No one gets to pick their parents nor siblings.

You say your sister is asking for money "for Mom" what is the money going for? I think you and your sister and brother need to sit down with a financial advisor and go over you mothers bills and monthly expenses. A financial plan can then be developed so each of you can contribute to your mothers care.

Oh. boy! Yours is a tough question. Living in CA, my flip answer is that I just can't wait to see the NH to go after $ from my sisters! Until then, unless I truly needed the money I probably wouldn't want them coming to my home and messing with Mom even if they contributed to her support. I agree you should be generous and send anything you can afford along with a nice card, and thank your sister for taking on the burden of your mother's care. If your sister is being unfair and is not mentally unstable, then hopefully your thanks will soften her heart. That is, if you can visit them without making trouble. My sisters can't seem to manage the not making trouble and it is simply not worth the spinning and brain pain that it causes mom. It is clear they don't want to contribute in any way other than trying to take over and leave chaos behind for me to clean up.

gonebabygone, I don't think it's a matter of people being rude - it's just that this post hits a nerve for a lot of people here - and the OP didn't give us enough information to give an informed response, other than what the law says...so many people are having a knee-jerk reaction to what they interpreted.

Always remember when you're viewing posts on the internet in a forum: you don't know who is behind the screen, what their background is, how rich/poor they are, what race they are, and in the context of this particular forum, you don't know what their relationship with their siblings and/or parents are. It's very easy to throw out statements that are judgemental, racist, sexist, or any other kind of -ist you want to name, because we are anonymous names on a screen while we're here. It's important to remember that while you are online, you can't see someone's facial expression or hear the tone of their voice or inflection of their words - so it's very hard to judge the way someone feels about what they're posting.

The other thing to remember is that this sort of forum brings together a HUGE melting pot of personalities. Some are happy caregivers, some are very embittered by their situation. Some are depressed, some may even be mentally ill. Some will be kind and gentle in their comments and responses, and some will just be blunt and say what they feel without sugarcoating it. It takes all kinds to make up the world we live in, and a forum like this is just a microcosm of all sorts of people and personalities. There are bound to be clashes from time to time, and some people will rub others the wrong way.

A good rule of thumb: "Be kind - for everyone is fighting some kind of battle".

It would be extremely helpful if the OP would come back and give more clarification to their situation, so we could fully understand:
-Why Mom gets "stirred up" when you're around?
-Why you're concerned that sis is going to "come after you" financially - what's the reason you think that? Has she threatened to do so?
-What is your family dynamic that sis keeps you from visiting Mom?

I truly hope the OP will come back so we can offer constructive help, other than just what the law says. Some of us are new caregivers, some of us have been at it for a very long time, and perhaps we could offer some helpful ideas.

Sis is doing the day to day care, so I give her the benefit of the doubt. "Going after you" requires a lawyer and court costs, so it is unlikely to happen. Please consider sitting down with sis and working something out. If you feel sis will misspend money, maybe you can offer to pay some utilities for mom, you can pay for depends...order online and have them delivered.

Whoa... I've recommended this site to several caregivers lately, but I won't recommend it anymore and I also won't read or post here. People are so rude!!!

Sounds like you have a touchy situation. I agree you need to check with an attorney. I have not heard of children being forced to support the parent but I am not in CA either. My question is what is the mother's financial situation and who is handling that money? Many times it has been shown that a caretaker has used up all the funds in illegal ways. Is this happening? If not, does the mother need state assistance in paying for her care? Following that would be what can you afford to do? What is the best for your mother and what is legal. This will depend on legal documents that should be in place like a medical POA, financial POA, will, and the wishes for her future care. I definitely would be checking into these things before making any decisions or taking any actions. Also, would you want to take legal action if the finances have been abuse? I hope you consult someone soon so the correct and legal steps can be taken.

I think you posted to exactly the right place. When caring for your parents, you have to set aside your predispositions. Your mother is no longer the person who raised you. Your sister is under stress. It is time to get together as though this was a business, and map out a plan.

Use your mother's money to buy a burial arrangement. Check to be sure she has her social security and/or Medicaid applied for. She should qualify as disabled with MD's verification no matter what age.

Provide Money to support mother's care to your sister from your mother's money. At some point you will need to pay for care, so pay your sister. I just had an agency set up respite coverage for me to take a 3 night 4 day break. They estimated $1600. Four hours = $92. We did a month in assisted living last year and that was about $6-7000!

What I wish my family could do is switch out with me to care for Dad while I vacation for a week or two.... They know him. If you don't have money, consider staying with mom for a long weekend once a month or more. Or have mom stay with you. I am lucky, Dad has enough money to cover respite expense, but it would disappear fast if he had to pay for a facility. Then what???

So, your sister is buying you all time before stuff gets really expensive. And it is very hard work. You are living two lives when just your own was more than enough. With kids, they improve. With elderly and demented, it will just get worse.

Do not be critical of your sister's care, do not talk with mom about stuff she can no longer process. Thank goodness your sister is doing this. You may not have valued your sister before, start now.

Keep reading these posts, most people do not complain of hardship as much as they are experiencing that hardship. Even this site is "candy coated".

It has only happened once in Pennsylvania. Other states with filial laws have not so far done so. California has filial laws. Since these are state laws, states cannot impose these sanctions on children living in a different state from their parents. I doubt states will start utilitizing this archaic law, it would create such an uproar throughout this country with it's citizens insisting on repealing this law in the states that have them. No state imposes laws on parents to financially support their impoverished adult children, they are afforded social programs. The elderly have as much right to utilize social programs as the younger people of this country!

Moms1of6, the simple answer to your question is NO. Your sister cannot force you. BUT the government or the nursing home can. It's that filial law that gives them the option.

As for your sister preventing you from seeing your mother, keep all emails that have her telling you this. It will be proof that you are not the one who chose not to visit but your sister, etc....

I just re read the OP because I was confused by the berating nature of a number of the answering posts. The OP left me with many questions but certainly not enough information to hazard judgement. There are so many different types of situations and circumstances out there...

Anyway, I knew nothing about the legalities of fillial responsibility before today. The topic was eye opening and from what I am reading online it's a complicated subject. One thing is clear, in most states with fillial responsibility laws, a persons first responsibility is to their own financial needs and that of their immediate family. The state cannot cause you to lose your own home to support your elderly parents.

Sorry, hit button too soon) Dad with Alzheimer's and Mom crazy until my younger bro found out they had a few bucks (we did not know either) Anyway, as soon Hasbro found this out, Mom started accusing us of stealing (impossible, and we are not that kind of people). Last year Mom put Dad in a NH, where he is doing much better. How sad is that? My family is shattered because of my brother's lies and my mother's delusions and gullibility. So it is not always as simple as "they took care of you, so now it's your turn to take care of them". I have run into my bro from time too time at the MY and he notches about always being the one now to help Mom with stuff, but we offer constantly to help and he refuses. Mom refuses any sort of help too.l know that many of you would give anything for some help. I wish I could help you. I wish I could help my own Mom but she and my bro have made sure that won't happen. At least I can visit my Dad.

OMG. I can't believe the way the OP is being blasted here. Perhaps her situation is like mine, where my husband and I were doing everything for my parents (Dad high-level

What does Mom want? Is the money your sister is asking for, for your mother? Do you ever have alone time with mom, and if so what do you think about her mental status? Who is your mothers legal representative?
The extra money your sister is asking for could be for depends if your mom is incontinent, they are expensive. Do you feel your sister is doing what she needs to do to care for mom, or do you feel she is abusive is some manner? Maybe your sister is overwhelmed with caregiving duties she forgets to send a 'thank you'. If you have doubts, you can call a family meeting & discuss mom's condition and what each sibling can do to help out or you can contact your local Area Agency on Aging for information about caregiving and seniors. You can contact Adult Protective Services for info on what to look for if you feel something not quite right or you suspect abuse of some type. If you have the funds to help out, make sure you keep records in the event you would need them at some point in the future. If you don't have the funds to be able to help out, tell your sister. I find family meetings can be very helpful, it doesn't have to be long, it can be done in a different location and everyone who cares for mom can receive updates on her condition, care and needs.

Interesting. Of course, this has the potential to open cans of worms all over the place. Children who have abusive parents who don't want a d**m think to do with them, having to pay for the oldsters upkeep? Where do you draw the line. Others with narcs who have no contact, and plan to keep it that way.
The over-riding concern, someone could have about 400,000 in retirement which, if frugally maintained, could support that person for a while. If the state comes in and demands upkeep, as mentioned earlier that person will also end up on a dole of sorts. (Perhaps the gubmint wants it that way in the end??) So what is gained. Gubmint creates two (or more) dependents whereas before there was only one or two.

Is your sister receiving money from the state of California to take care of your mom? If she is, I should think that would be sufficient. My in-laws lived in California. My sister-in-law received money for taking care of her mother, but her mother was living in my sister-in-law's house. My sister-in-law also cashed her mother's social security checks. If your sister is in a similar situation and doing the same thing, I don't see why you'd need to give her extra cash.

Dr Chris look up "hcr vs pittas". Pennsylvania is at the forefront of collecting from children. What did Mr. Pittas in? He refused to disclose assets and the Judge took a very dim view of that.

I would like to see a response from an attorney. I do not believe that any state can force children to impoverish themselves to care for a parent, but would appreciate verification.

Your sister is taking care of your Mother 24/7 and you are not contributing? Shame on you.

One HUGE thing to remember, until you have had a sibling and been in this situation personally, you simply cannot understand the dynamics of how bad it can get. For me, I have always been the one who had to handle everything. It is heartbreaking to know that someone I grew up with and love more than I love my own life could be so uncaring and selfish...you really can't believe it will happen to you, until it does.

Have to agree with some people here. You should be contributing financially to your mom's care since your sister is doing all the physical care. However, you should also be making sure you have access to your mom. If you are stirring her up, why is that? Are you arguing with her or not being as patient as you should. You should and deserve to be able to visit with your mom but you also need to understand her condition and when you see her it should be pleasant and loving for both of you. If you are concerned with your mom's finances then you need to politely without accusation, sit down with your sister and discuss it. If she sees you are really concerned with your mother and willing to help financially since you can't help physically, she may change her attitude. Sorry but I am an only child and I care for my mother alone with no help except wonderful support from friends. I also see friends struggle to care for elderly parents while their siblings visit only on holidays and proceed to criticize everything that they do and how their parent is being cared for. Then they go back to their lives and you don't see or hear from them until the next holiday. And on top of that they make a huge stink whenever the subject of financial support comes up. Very sad.

Tough situation, and like some of the others stated, it's terribly difficult caring for the relative with Dementia. I am sorry your sister is trying to restrict your access to your mom, I totally disagree, however, if you can afford to contribute to the care of your mom (not for your sister's sake but your mom) then maybe pay for a bill (directly pay it) or if you can speak to your sister maybe ask what she has in mind? Try to forget about a thank you note right now, because I am sure your sister is beyond overwhelmed right about now. I too am a caregiver along with one of my brother's, we both are doing everything we can for my mom. My bro contributes to pay some of her rent at the assisted living, and I cover the cost of phone/cable bills. We both contribute the time for med administration (to save her a little bit more money), and I give her a bath (again to save her a little more money, until we find a place a little more reasonable). It's exhausting work. I have an older brother who seldom contacts my mom but it would be great if he could contribute some money. The relationship with him is strained so I continue procrastinating contacting him. But I imagine he will not contribute at all. My heart goes out to you and your family.

IMO, your question should not have been posted on this site. It is for caregivers -- people like your sister -- whether she is right or wrong. If she is wrong, this crew of caregivers would surely tell her so. You write that when your sister asks for money that you don't send anything. For YOUR mother?! That's like the father who doesn't pay child support but demands visitation rights. He may have legal entitlements, but what about his morality? When the mother who is attending to the child's every needs 24/7 has to ASK for financial assistance, why should she say, "Thank you?" The father should be thanking her. You still don't get it? Well that's a huge part of what care giving is: role reversal. The child becomes the parent. You did not come to this site explaining that your finances were limited and asking what could you do to assist your sister, the caregiver. But this generous care giving membership tried to help anyway. That's what caregivers do. They selflessly go the extra mile. Think about your sister. Now who are you?

You should be more gracious and help your sister with at least finances if nothing more. The physical and emotional toll of caring for the elderly is devastating, creating resentments toward siblings who don't / or won't help. In every family the burden is taken up by one compassionate adult child while the rest of the siblings watch and make comments. I'm in a similar situation and my advice to you is to help in any way you can because you have it easy. Put yourself in your sister's shoes and be more compassionate. Follow the Golden Rule. Would you like your children to treat you the way you're treating your mother? They are watching your example. Good luck!

I will have to google this also, I am surprised. First of all Moms1of6, does your Mom have any assets, SS, cd's etc? You should consult an elder attorney because your Moms money should be used first for her care, including paying your sister for caregiving, even if she doesnt need it all for medical care. I have gone through all the dementia stages with my mom and also all of her assets,and now my husband is supporting us other than my moms monthly ss/va which I use to respite and diapers/etc. I think a trip to a lawyer is in order. If your sister is like some of us, she may never place her Mom into a nursing home and will need financial and emotional support for a very long time. Taking good care of a parent at home means they live many long years my Moms doctor said. No way in H*** would my siblings ever help at all, financially or otherwise. Is your sister the DPOA/H?

I agree with Countrymouse. I'm not sure why sis has to come after you for anything. I can assure you that caring for an elderly parent or loved one 24/7 is not easy, and if all you are being asked to do is help financially now and then, you are coming out on the easy end of the deal. True enough, for me, I am here because I want to be and I am not planning on going anywhere, God willing, but I have lost everything I ever worked for attempting to care for my Mom and while I would do it again, when I received the papers informing me the bank was about to foreclose on me, the only response I got from my sibling was "gee I hate to hear that"....all the while they don't miss a beat at anything, living a high life, rarely bringing anything, including meager supplies. The one time I attempted to address it I was blown out of the water about my "d*mn" cats, how sorry I felt for myself, etc. etc.......so there is, in addition to no financial help for "OUR" mother, there is no appreciation either and it is the latter which hurts. I don't know your particular situation, background, dynamics, etc. but could be your sister is so worn out and exhausted and fed up with the lack of appreciation then seeing you pop in for a visit here and there is even inflammatory. I know I was that way for a long time and while I never told them not to come, as I believe that is wrong as well, I did hate to see them coming for their once a month visit, for all of an hour or two, just having a good old time and then they were gone again...their guilt relieved apparently. Oh, I forget the part about the commentary about how i have let the house go, let myself go, blah blah blah..sorry, as you can tell this is a touchy issue for me....it's best to work together...and makes for some hurt feelings all around when their is no cooperation. And it is best for our loved ones if we work together...if we are able to....

Pam is correct. Your sister may try on her own to force you to pay. But, you should be more concerned if it's Medicaid or the nursing home. More and more states are passing what is called the "filial responsibility law."

Many states have filial responsibility laws that make children responsible for their parents’ medical care, however these laws are rarely enforced.

*Filial Responsibility Laws
More than half of the states have “filial responsibility” laws that make adult children responsible for their parents’ medical care, if their parents can’t pay. These rules do not apply when a patient qualifies for Medicare – in that case, the Medicare system pays.

However, if a patient can’t pay for care received before qualifying for Medicare, filial responsibility laws could require the patient’s child or children to pay. Most filial responsibility laws take an adult child’s ability to pay into account.

These laws are generally designed to minimize the parent’s burden on the state’s welfare system. Most allow any long-term care providers to sue family members for payment, but others make failing to care for a parent a criminal offense.

*Generally Not Enforced
Most states that have filial responsibility laws don’t enforce them, here’s why: Most elders who can’t pay for care receive federal assistance through Medicaid, and federal law specifically prohibits going after adult children. Also, most folks who need help paying for nursing home care qualify for Medicaid and it’s unusual for someone to rack up a large bill before qualifying. So, because there is so little opportunity to apply filial responsibility laws, they very rarely affect families.

*In most states, for a child to be held accountable for a parent’s bill, all of these things would have to be true:
- The parent received care in a state that has a filial responsibility law.
- The parent did not qualify for Medicaid when receiving care.
- The parent does not have the money to pay the bill.
- The child has the money to pay the bill.
- The caregiver chooses to sue the child.

* A Rare Case
Although, in practice, these laws rarely cause children have to pay for their parents’ bills, a 2012 Pennsylvania appeals court ruled that an adult son of a nursing home resident would have to pay his mother’s $93,000 nursing home bill based on the Pennsylvania filial responsibility law.

This is a rare case because
1) the mother made just enough money through a pension not to qualify for Medicaid, and
2) the court allowed a private institution to sue the son, whereas filial responsibility laws are generally designed to empower the state to recover payments to reduce the burden on welfare. While this is an unusual case, some practitioners wonder if rising care costs will cause more cases like this to surface.

With that said, if I had the option to send my father to a nursing home, I would sure love to have the NH go after my siblings to pay for it. I would be overlooked since I supplied the manual labor, and the day-to-day expenses (pampers, wipes, toilet tissues, Depends pampers, etc...) Since my siblings don't help physically or financially, it would be great if the NH went after them and not me (being seen as easy picking.)