I am concerned about my mother's toilet needs in the middle of the night. Advice?

Someday, there will be technology that detects a wet depends, records the time, and the caregiver can track giving fluids at hour of sleep, x the hour of wet depends, create a rigid schedule, and change the depends to last the rest of the night, or, if possible, ambulate to toilet on that most likely to go schedule.

The benefit: For the caregiver, knowing you will be up, when, for how long-having some control over that will be less frustrating and allow for better rest when you do get it. For the 'patient', benefit is having no wet depends for hardly anytime at all.
Of course, this won't solve all the issues with you getting your REM sleep.
Sorry you are, and so many are having to go through this.

JudyAnn - Mscoulter's idea is certainly a solution to consider - it wasn't planned but this is pretty much how they deal with my moms nighttime issue at her NH. Mom doesn't wake up needing to go - she wets in her sleep. Mom is also a major mobility risk anytime of day but especially when half asleep in the middle of the night. Anyhow - if your mom begins using a nighttime diaper with liner etc and wets at night, know that you'll need to be showering/ throughly cleaning her almost daily - something most elderly come to strongly resist. While adult diapers are a necessary evil in the lives of a lot of elderly folks - urinary track infection risks become much greater with their use. Something to consider on your pros and cons list.

Put a diaper doubler in her diaper with a bed pad and tell her that she must use it during the night. Whether it is you or a 24 hour caregiver, you must get at least 8 hours sleep. I went through this with my mom and it was the only way because I was going crazy from sleep deprivation.

JudyAnn - In your reply you asked "No one has cared for frail relatives with bladder needs at home?" Up to the point I began typing this, you had but one answer that directly gave you the advice you are seeking - other answers got to the specific topic amongst their other advice. And all the other advice was basically the same theme - why is that? Obvious. Most of these people have first hand experience at doing what you are about to do - and if not trying to dissuade you, at a minimum they advise that you really reconsider. Those like me, who never cared for our elderly loved ones in our homes, by our selves, are advising you the same. I guess its presumptious to assume you don't have any experience with this level of care - I mean, you know it took three people to do the job your are going to undertake. Three people who in an AL situation probably didn't have to do the cooking, the laundry, the showering, organizing and dispersing, medication all while taking care of their own home, husband and self. Usually another employee performs these additional jobs and when the direct caregivers eight hours are over they go home - but you are home. What I'm having a problem understanding - even though you explained your motives - is why you would take your mom from a successful AL situation. Just getting our loved ones into AL would be a minor miricle for a lot of people here. Your mom has been there for a few years - knows the routines, the staff, her living space and probably has friends that she socializes with. And you want to take your mom from there to live with you for "quality time"? Read enough posts here from people caring for frail, elderly loved ones in their homes and you'll know getting up at night for a potty break is only one of the problems they face. I never, ever considered moving my mom in with my family. I've had three back surgeries, my adult son with severe autism lives at home and I have a small two bedroom house that is not wheelchair friendly. But even if those factors didn't exist, I still wouldn't do it. As best I can, I want my time with my mother to be "quality" - not spent thinking of ways I could kill her in her sleep and make it look like an accident! You mention plan B if things don't work out - why put your mother in the position of having to move back, new space, new routines to learn, no friends to start, when she is taken care of where she is - and you can still spend quality time with her. In my experience every time we had to move my mom, it took a toll on her - and not one that was recouped. Maybe it would be different for your mom, maybe not. Just for informational purposes - try that old method of helping to come to a decision. Piece of paper, two columns, pros and cons of having your mom move in with you. Before you start, spend a few hours here looking at posts from the people who are doing, or have done what your about to take on. Be honest. Be sure to consider the likelihood that mom will change in personality and in needs. It's not too late nor unreasonable to take a little more time to really consider the facts and likelihoods of what you now already are expressing concerns over.

Picture this- my 92 year old father was 230# of frailty- could use a walker but where he landed in bed was it- couldn't roll over, get up, or move an inch in any direction. My 88 year old mother (with back problems) had to help him get in/out of bed and reposition him for comfort day and night- who was going to get hurt first? I investigated solutions and developed an expertise in mobility issues- would be glad to offer suggestions if I have more details. My father was able to safely "help himself" in the bed area eliminating the need for my mother's help- keeping him home years longer. Can't say whether your plan is good or bad- but proper assistive products and home helpers may be critical to making things work. In the toilet situation you mentioned- products allowing your mother to safely get herself out of bed to use a bedside commode could be key to your sanity. In many cases this eliminates the need for a paid night shift. Good luck and please let me know if I can help with suggestions.

Quality time and caregiving IMO are 2 different things. Spending time visiting, talking, sharing and reminiscing are far different than helping her to the toilet in the middle of the night, changing depends, giving meds, waiting on her needs etc If you want quality time, then find a good place that can tend to her 24 hr needs and then visit often, knowing in your heart you did the right thing for your health, her well being, and that of your family. Good luck

JudyAnn - so you & your husband have been living abroad the past 6 years during which you mother has been in AL with 3 shifts a day of care. You all are moving back to States & mom is going to move in with you as you want to now have quantity time with mom.

That's in a nutshell it, right?

Is it going to work? Well maybe but may have the same probability as me getting back into a size 4 rather than a size 14. As one who has lives abroad for periods of time, the adjustment of being back in the states is in & of itself a hurdle. Your body clock will be off for weeks. You mind will constantly be filtering change of language & culture (& perhaps some regret). Even if you've been living where US English is spoken everwhere. If you travel back & forth regular & have a homebase in each & fluently multilingual & multicultural, it's not quite the issue but will require adjustment nevertheless.

Then add onto this, taking on caregiving for a elder who is 6 years older & more frail than when you last were around her & that you know needs 3 shifts of caregivers presently. That you know has worn out your sister even with mom being in AL with 3 shifts of care. That somehow you being her 24/7 caregiver in your home is going to provide & make up for quality time you've missed with mom those last 6 years. Really is this at all realistic?

Please, please, please speak clearly with your husband on all this. If you all are moving back because he's retiring from a job abroad.....he is not going to be at all happy about coming back to the US to essentially become a unpaid caregiver & emptying a porta potty & having a needy elder 24/7 in the home. If you all lived in a country where all the expats have help, maids, drivers.....& he was used to having staff at work......well he is not going to be happy now having to do scut work no matter how much he likes his MIL. Please think about this.....Being sleep deprived coukd be the least of your problems.

4 years ago my Mom came to live in our house. She also has mobility issues. My Mom's case sounds like your case. Both my husband and I work full time. We hired a caretaker to come in during the weekdays. At night my Mom wears depends and calls me when she needs to use the restroom. Some nights its one call and some nights it can be 2 or 3. My sister who lives back East comes for "Mom relief" about 3 x year. This break helps us to rest. You need time away from Mom duty to recharge. I would recommend having someone come in on a daily basis. It doesn't have to be for 8 hours. This way you can get out of the house for errands and such and not worry about leaving your Mom for an extended amount of time.

My wife uses a bedside toilet every night. She is a fall risk but is able to handle the bedside toilet. I clean it out next morning

In my experience, the way to have 'quality time" with an elderly parent is to have the ability to visit, chat, do fun things and then leave, so that you each have your own lives. 24/7 caregiving is burdensome and does not lead to making fond memories.

Thanks for the explanation. Quality time with Mom is a great goal. Speaking from experience, one can have quality time with a parent in a care center, too. I'm glad to see you are realistic enough to look at this as a "trial."

My husband needed assistance any time he got up in the night. I was sleep deprived the entire ten years I cared for him. That was my choice. That was my soulmate. Could I have done that for my mother? Sorry, I don't think so. The nature of the relationship is just different.

To begin with, the sleep deprivation was so severe I knew it would not be safe to continue that way. He doctors came up with solutions to help him sleep through the night most nights. That made it possible. He still got up to go to the bathroom at least once, but that was manageable. I also had daytime help coming in the morning and more than once I stay in bed for a while after she came.

Good luck to you!

Thank you for honest opinions everyone. I have lived overseas for the past 6 years and so we have wanted some quality time with my Mom. I have to move her from my sister's assisted living place because I need to be the daughter doing the primary care since my sister has special needs adult children and is stretched too thin. So far no one in her bloodline has lived past the age my mother will be turning this month. We want to give it a trial to see if we can care for her and ourselves well. We have assisted living places in our town researched as a back up and to give us respite care for her. So it seems like once people have mobility problems that is the issue that makes people put relatives in homes or hire home care at night? No one has cared for frail relatives with bladder needs at home? and lived to tell about it?(smile)

You need to get a night shift to care for mother then, you need to reconcile yourself to being sleep-deprived for the rest of your mother's life, or you need for her to be in care center when a small number of people can take care of relatively large number of people overnight, thus being more cost effective than one-on-one overnight care.

Those are the choices I see.

Why are you planning to bring her home at this time?

JudyAnn, I am the same when it comes to be awaken at night, it is almost impossible for me to go back to sleep... thus it always ruins the next day as I am exhausted. I couldn't imagine having that happening every single night, day after day after day. It will ruin your health very quickly.

What is the reason you are attempting to bring your Mom into your home? Does your Mom dislike where she is living? In the 3 years she had been in Assisted Living, she probably has made friends with people of her own generation... would she be around anyone her own age if she lived at home?

If Mom falls on a regular basis, would you be able to correctly pick her up, so not to unintentionally harm her? Have you picked her up in the past? If not, an elder become dead weight, it's like trying to pick up a 100 lb to 200 lb barbell.

Is Assisted Living becoming too expensive? The place where my Dad lives, they have it set up where one can share an apartment with other, thus cut down on the expenses. Or have you looked into a Medicaid Waiver depending on if your State offers such for Assisted Living?

There is a little voice in your head trying to warn you not to do this. No single person can replace three shifts of nurses. Get her to a nursing home or you could easily be among the 30% of caregivers who die before their patients.

JudyAnn, is there a reason that you need to move your mother in with you? I wondered if she is running out of money or you just want to spend more time with her. Or if her needs are so much now that assisted living can no longer accommodate her.

Moving her in with you will be a lot of work and you may find that it is harder than you can imagine. I understand if it is what you need to do. A bedside commode would help, but if your mother is prone to fall, she may fall as easily going to the commode as going to the bathroom.

We have had many people in the group take care of their loved ones at home who were more frail. I hope that some of the people who know the technicalities of what you will be facing will join this discussion. They will have some good advice, I'm sure.

If she has been in AL for 3 years, with 3 shifts of caregivers.. how do you think you are going to do this? Not being smart arssed here, just really want to know? I know my father took out 3 of us when he morphed into all night man,, and she will. And it will get worse.. and you WILL get no sleep.. I didn;t nor did my mom or hubs. We had to put into MC just to get our feet back under us, and it was the best move we made (don;t tell MOm I said that!)