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Perhaps nice for small families with little children, but a minefield for many extended families, let alone the lonely.


‘Halloween’ (All Hallows Eve) in the religious calendar is for remembering the dead, the saints and martyrs – probably mixed up with the end of summer, harvest home, and pre-Christian festivals for those things too. Turning it into lollies and vandalism is not in anyone’s interests, certainly not for children, their behaviour, their teeth or their nutrition.


‘Thanksgiving’ was the Harvest Festival, when the Pilgrim Fathers had survived a summer with enough food to last through the winter. In a nation with serious obesity problems, a festival based on lots of food surely deserves a re-think.


‘Christmas’ is the time for celebrating the birth of Jesus. It has been overtaken by gift buying (and of course more food). If you actually read the New Testament, the three wise men who came from the East were not at the crib in Bethlehem with their presents. They went first to Herod, who sent them off to find the ‘young child’. When they didn’t return promptly, Herod ordered the slaughter of the innocents, all boys under two. An accurate celebration might mean waiting a couple of years to hand over gold, frankincense or myrrh, then manage a mass murder of toddlers. This stupid suggestion is no sillier than plastic trees, glass baubles, electric lights, heaps of parcels that are often unwanted, and lots of alcohol.


I think what I am suggesting is to walk away from ‘celebrations’ that cause more problems than pleasure, to know what we value and want to celebrate, and pick a good way for that to work. At a minimum, to stop feeling guilty if things don’t work out like a good old fashioned ‘leave it to Beaver’ way.

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You really miss Jake eh Cap?🙁

Just remember we are all friends on here. At least most of us.

All humor aside.
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my son jake was really good with that " whats really going on " style of humor .

a funeral procession passed by us one time with a total of a hearse and two additional cars .
" yea , she didnt have any money " jake observes .

another time he stuck his head out the truck window and admonished a group of his peers taking a smoke break out front of the court ordered substance rehab program -- calling them " QUITTERS " .

i s'pose he / we got that style of humor from years of the simpsons . aint nothing on that show as it seems .
( vote quimby )
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Okay.
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gershun,
theres a particular kind of humor that i like . when i meet a person who says what is expected of them , then mutters what theyre " really thinking " in a lower tone -- it plain cracks me up .

those people generally dont mean to hurt anyone -- they just have a quirky view ( and healthy skepticism ) of the world .

what people say and what is being implied is hardly ever one and the same .
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Cap, you treat most threads like an uncensored, free for all anyway..........What do you want?
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Wow such drama! Margaret how is Christmas celebrated where you are? I agree there is alot of commercialism but there are several ways to view that. People who are in retail rely greatly on the business generated there. I am retired but worked at a number of small businesses for years. One of my daughters and son in law have a retail store. Their livelihood is based greatly on holidays.

I personally do not go overboard on Christmas gifts but I enjoy picking out something I put thought into for my immediate family. In that way I am helping the economy. I share each holiday with some or all family. There is a sense of joy in watching family open gifts. Personally I would love to do away with stockings for the adults but am outnumbered there

My husband has a tradition in his family that everyone gets an orange because when his grandparents were young that was all that they could afford. So everyone gets one and then they all go into the refrigerator.

Yes holidays can cause stress but also bring joy. We go to church on Christmas Eve and have a nice dinner after. Christmas day we have another nice dinner. Then I don't feel like cooking for awhile.

I think it is important for families to come together and celebrate as they choose. There must be commercialism in your country too.
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they oughtta let us have an uncensored ' free for all ' thread . a place to get it all out of your system ( caregiving IS a trial of a lifetime . )

problem is my employer ( state ) would fire me two sentences in and send me to guantanamo by the end of the first paragraph .

this PC crap is more than stifling the industry of humor -- its approaching thought policing territory .
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outta just break into three threads . one for people who love the holidays ( fa la la la LA ) ,
one for the indifferent ,
and one for the people who would like to stick a fork in your throat at the mention of it .

probably need one for the perpetually indignant too .

what the heck is wrong with people when they cant share opinions without throwing a tantrum ?
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I think that the moderators are probably off enjoying a long holiday break, although it's equally possible that nobody has contacted them about this thread going sideways.
And of course the more we comment the longer this thread stays alive 🙃
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I think it's ironic that I asked Margaret how we'd view the holidays in Australia from a distance and probably find it equally lacking and my comment was removed.🤔
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I have just one question, I have not read this thread. Is there really a difference between Aussie holiday preparations, shopping and stress? I really do not think so, I believe it is the perception played out in the media.

I once had a cultural geography class and there was an Aussie in it. Some of the things that came out of her mouth about the U.S. cultural and ethnic differences with Australia were just shockingly unbelievable. Just a different way of thinking and expressing themselves.

Nothing personal, at all, intended towards Margaret.
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This thread needs to come down immediately. Margaret’s post isn’t the problem.
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there isnt anything wrong ( imo ) with your outside observations margaret . people are just nuts .

one gal says she aint coming back till everybody says only the things she wants to hear . makes my ( people are nuts ) point perfectly .

this caregiving business ( and associated forum ) are excruciating in the absence of humor . humor often gets a little edgy and some people just cant pass up a chance to be offended . they should drop some acid and laugh for 3 days -- it'd do em good .
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Now I’m even more startled! Any ‘critical’ outsider comment starts an international war? The point was supposed to be how it stands out that three stressful holidays in a row puts a lot of pressure on lots of people. No, ‘the point of the original post was NOT to offend people by bashing their country and customs,’ or to say that ‘holidays suck’, or to stop God Blessing America (or the rest of the world). Dorothy Parker was an American poet, and neither she nor me was ‘drizzling peace and Christianity’. For Pity’s Sake, let’s stop this thread.
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I think it is time to let this thread die, I think poor Margaret must have been having an uncharacteristic moment of poor forethought when she made her original comments.

The forum has actually been pretty tame this year when it comes to voicing holiday angst BUT it is nonetheless a theme that comes up with regularity - this is definitely a case where it's OK for those involved to say nasty things but an outsider dare not.
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Lealonnie, good points.  Perhaps I should have used "explain", or "educate", something less defensive.

Perhaps if more people reported offensive posters, something would be done.   If not, then I suspect that people will just leave.  No one needs to have to skip posts b/c they're crude and low class.

I might even call the Admins on Monday and find outdirectly if any action will be taken.   In the past offensive posts were often left up, perhaps because they generate page hits.
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GA....not thinking we have to justify ourselves or our behaviors to the OP. Nor explain why our American holidays are NOT "horrible".

Most Americans work our asses off with 2 and 3 jobs to be able to live....and to afford to give our kids a few gifts for Christmas. What I do with my hard earned money is MY business.

The streets here AREN'T paved with gold, contrary to foreign opinion.

I did report, several times, inappropriate comments here which still are up in plain sight.

I'm finished reading this thread, myself, even though it's like a train wreck where you can't look away.
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about the direction this thread has taken, specifically the personalization by one person who has repeatedly resorted to inappropriate vernacular and topics irrelevant to not only the topic of this thread but of the forum in general.

But why do posters here tolerate that? Take the thread back, report the offensive comments, and ask the Admins to help clean the thread up by eliminating the inappropriate, low class and vulgar comments. If they don't, then boycott the thread and start a new one.

I'm not the only one who found Margaret's comments prejudicial and somewhat patronizing as well.    She's made some good contributions though elsewhere though, so perhaps she would feel less critical if we acquainted her with what we CAN do that isn't commercialized?

And I see no reason why some bragging about accomplishments, reach-out and caregiving activities beyond family shouldn't be addressed.

Something that's drawn my attention to the other side of commercialism is the generosity of people at this time of the year.

For years Goodfellows astood in street intersections, and Marine Toys for Tots collected funds and toys for children Commercial organizations such as those with soup kitchens support people in need throughout the year, not just at a religious holiday.

To me, Americans' generosity extends to different days, situations, and isn't limited to being religious based.

I stumbled on a site with a list of nonprofits and organizations that counteract the commercialism by showing a giving spirit, some throughout the year.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/causes/35-reputable-charities-to-help-this-holiday-season/ss-BBXqPv7?ocid=spartandhp

I think generosity and reaching out counteracts the negativity of commercialism. And I know for a fact that my friends, family, and obviously some here don't fall into the BUY! BUY! trap.

Perhaps I'm being overbearing, but it irks me when people are maneuvered into inappropriate situations on forums by domineering, foul mouthed self focused people. So, PLEASE, take back your desire for a more moderate, helpful response, and help Margaret see what she doesn't have the opportunity to view from "Down Under":

1. Share what you, your family, your school, religious organization, and friends do for holidays, not just the end of the year ones but those throughout the year.

2. Remember that Veterans' and Memorial Days are NOT as commercialized, but show real support for those who have served.

When my father was in a rehab during Veterans' Day, one of the home care agencies with a strong community outreach leader organized ceremonies at the rehab. Reps of each service were there, in full uniform, circulating and getting acquainted with the residents. And each resident was awarded a certificate for service.

THESE show not only what Americans can do to show support, w/o spending hundreds of dollars, but just by reaching out to people in medically unpleasant situations, their families and friends.

3. Folks here probably have limited time to volunteer, but can share cards, even if they're homemade. My father received these from children through Meals on Wheels. I have holiday cards that I've received from donations to military organizations. I'm going to add some pleasant greetings and deliver them to MOW sites, as well as to the good rehabs where Dad spent time (assuming they'll take them).

4. I know of two members here who do reach-out activities, in hospitals and at hospice. How many others are there, whether it's for people or for animals? Senior centers, MOW, and other good works? Help with ride sharing and/or delivery to medical appointments? Help with groceries? Home chores?

An acquaintance is a handyman and works primarily with veterans' organizations. I've learned that some Methodist churches also have reach-out home chore activities.

There are so many good things we do, that our reputation shouldn't be as slaves to commercialism.
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:)>
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Good luck with that, Captain. I hope it works out for you.
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everybody is within their rights today . thats great . it means im ( probably ) within my rights to provoke these gals on here in hopes one of em will get so frustrated they come to indiana to ' mix it up ' with me and end up staying for a few days -- for the great homemade beer of course .

love and hate are two sides of the same coin .
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The criticism of consumerism is legitimate, but the original comment was directed specifically at the US by someone who seems to think she knows all about us "from a distance" based on the internet. Our holidays suck and we should stop celebrating anything they don't do in Australia. I was ready to just ignore that. Then she comes back drizzling peace, love, and Christianity and claiming that was her original point. She's got a right to do that too. I have a right to point out the hypocrisy of it.
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heres the link to a local ( indiana ) news story that takes a global look at holiday consumerism and ' black friday ' in particular . if many people criticize the absurdity of it perhaps they make legitimate observations .

https://cbs4indy.com/2019/11/29/black-friday-goes-global-but-not-everyones-happy/
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ive worked for a lot of jerks and a lot of faux christians too .

the latter will resort to dam near homicide to possess another dollar .

it really doesnt make sense to me -- you cant take a dime of it with you .

im not bashing christians ( or any faith ) . most believers have great basic values ( imo ) .
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"everybody is offended over something . its the newest american custom"

There's something to that, and I can deal with people being offensive jerks. It's doing that and then coming back all sanctimonious over the babe in the manger that gags me.
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Meh, I like the holidays fine. I do think some are over commercialized but it doesn't bother me much. My family has been through a lot in the past 5 years, my husband has had 2 open heart surgeries back to back, my daughter had an AVM rupture in her brain while pregnant resulting in 2 brain surgeries, coding 5 times. She is fine other than some balance and vision problems and the child was perfect. All of this while having mom with me for these 5 years; I am the only child of 4 who cares for her. Yesterday she pooped in my hands.

Am I tired? Yeah. Am I bitter? No. My contentment and faith is somehow stronger than before. I do not begrudge anybody for wanting to celebrate the holidays however they want. Do it while you can and with who you love. It doesn't last that long.
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everybody is offended over something . its the newest american custom .
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"I thought that this lovely poem might get things back on track:"

Really? I thought the point of your original post was to offend people by bashing their country and customs.
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Charlie Brown's Christmas came out in 1965 and was a commentary on consumerism and the loss of the true meaning of the day. Dickens published A Christmas Carol way back in 1843. It's obvious there isn't anything new going on.
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I love our American holidays. My husband just told me that I am a traditionalist Wednesday as I make my own turkey on Thanksgiving. Ditto the traditions we had growing up. I remember soft lights on the Christmas tree coming home from Midnight Mass & the cookies we left for Santa, with lovely wrapped presents (not too many and good things like jigsaw puzzles and little things that brought great happiness even if the gift was less than $10. It’s not like that now.

Gone are the days of traveling anywhere for the holidays. In our newly married years I remember driving from White Plains NY to Long Island when the trip was 4 1/2 hrs for a normal 1.5 hr drive. They can come to our house and they did (family) for many years.

Those visits stopped 15 yrs ago or so as the children grew to adults who got married and went their own way.

I still cook my turkey, buy a real Christmas tree, have my traditional special dinners but just for hubby and me.

Matter of fact I told my husband today that this past Thanksgiving I felt guilt free for the first time ever. All of my nuclear family are gone. I used to worry every holiday season about my mom & brother being alone (never bothered them but always bothered me). Because of my job (RN) I always have had to work holidays. This Thanksgiving I had no such worries. It felt good.

But it back to American holidays yes Christmas has become very materialistic unfortunately. But there are still plenty of us that still celebrate with simplicity. A Child is born & he is our Savior so it’s a happy time of hope.
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