I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
and they suggested to send him to the nursing home in his home town.(the AL was there also). We lived 1 1/2 hrs from there, but it was where my dad wanted to be. The Behavioral facility called at 2:30pm to take him to the NH.
By the time my husband got off work and we collected him
it was 11:30pm when we finally left and started back home.
By 5:00 the next morning the NH said he couldn’t stay. Apparently, my dad got up in the middle of the night and went into someone’s room and hit them and broke the skin on a lady. My dad was out of his mind and I could not get anyone to help me. They sent him a behavioral facility for another 20 days where they insisted he was just a pleasure.
i didn’t get it. From that facility I had him transferred to a NH
just down the road from me so I could be onsite more. He had tried to take the trac out of a patient and was stealing things off the carts in the middle of the night. He was never mean to me but after he was there 5 days the NH
called and said they were sending him to another mental health facility. He was there 3 days and had a fall and had to have the 3rd CT in the past 6 months. After Another day they sent him to the hospital because his kidneys were not working correctly. He was there for 16 days and transferred to there mental health floor. By this time my dad was just just done. He got pneumonia while there and the doctor told me that I needed to put him in hospice care. I stayed with him everyday and night and I have to say that they took
excellent care of him while he was there. It was the most traumatic experience for him and me. No one was any help with a dementia patient. They acted like they had never seen anyone act this way. I know my dad was not the only person to have violent episodes. I only hope that no one has to endure what my dad did for the last 3 mos of his life.
sorry to be so long but I guess I needed to tell someone this.
Yep. I’d say it’s official. CC CLEARLY has personal space issues. CLEARLY!
I know that if someone - other than Rainman - tried a Helen Keller and snatched food off of my plate, they’d of wound up with a fork in the back of their hand. And, yes - I have personal space issues. CLEARLY.
Maybe this explains the thing with staff allowing CC to keep her TV on into the dead of night. They’re afraid to turn it off?
If that facility has any single rooms - regardless of her ability to pay - they should move CC into one. Rewarding the wicked? Perhaps. But it certainly would keep everyone a wee bit safer.
In the mean time... Someone ought to run the whole personal space thing by MIL - since she isn’t wanting to change rooms and the odds of CC being moved look slim. How much MIL will get it or retain it is questionable. But it’s still better than not addressing this as a preventative measure.
EDIT: What’s the whole “pretend daughter” thing? I must have missed that.
BUT. In this one particular incident- the actual “offense” committed by MIL in putting her dirty laundry in CC’s hamper - I have to say that it probably would have ticked me off as well.
It sounds like they each have their own hamper, yes? So, why would MIL do that? An individual living in a setting like that has so very little that is their own - I can see why CC saw it as a personal space violation and got pizzed. AND, especially if by the off chance the soiled clothing that MIL was depositing was... umm... “soiled” in the worst possible way? Yeah, I gotta say - I’d of likely handed MIL her azz as well. “Put your nasty pee soaked, chitapalooza pajamas in your own effing hamper”.
Perhaps MIL is knowingly or unknowingly crossing other personal space boundaries as well? After all - with CC out of the room all day and MIL in it, I could see how MIL might start to treat the whole room - sans CC’s bed - as her own.
Just saying.
But that's me, and you, Dorker, aren't the person in charge of MIL's well-being. What is DH's take on this?
She is obviously creating some issues there, .. (has been though, not new) .. and so they have to find a way to get it dealt with. I can't imagine the lawsuit that could be brought upon them should a resident be seriously injured because of CC's volatility.
I guess the approach, for this moment, it's said, until they can get answers from "Corporate" . .is they provide a minder, 24/7. They say they will get answers from Corporate first of the week.
I don't know that MIL doesn't use some inflection to her tone, and/or ask things in some wrong way and somehow spur this on .. who knows .. I'm not there, . but to be subject to verbal onslaught .. assuming MIL doesn't prompt it, . isn't right.
And that poor other lady .. granted .. I guess these things happen .. but the woman, for whatever reason .. decided to reach over to CC's plate for a bite of CC's chicken on her plate .. as a result she was assaulted, and bleeding and transported to the hospital.
I don't see, . .how they can keep that kinda volatility in the midst of others and call themselves being responsible for each individual's safety. Right now, all are safe, there is a minder around the clock, yes even sitting in the room during sleeping hours .. 24/7. But that can't be status quo .. I'm quite sure.
Do they get asked to leave?
They cant provide a monitor 24/7 indefinitely.
I guess your father will have to learn the hard way. So ridiculous to not bring in any home health aid. Eventually the blocks will all tumble down and they may have no other choice but not your problem.
I can't imagine your dad is holding down anything he eats. My FIL was exactly the same. When the chemo started to worsen his overall health--he had to quit it.
He must still life is worth living if he can bear these awful side effects and keep on wanting to go forward.
I know he's not easy to 'talk to' in a father-daughterly way. SO he keeps it all inside and then blows up at the people who care. Really sad.
When does SIL come back to start plates whirling in the air? She's coming to get MIL moved (she hopes) and start emptying the house.
I don't care for the idea of lying to MIL. Just take her out somewhere else if celebrating her 90th is such a big deal. A restaurant of ANY kind where the bathrooms are ADA approved would be fine. Balloons, a cake, gifts--she doesn't truly care WHERE she goes, she just wants to have a day out. Can't that be accomplished.
As someone who had exactly 3 people remember her birthday (one of my kids, my BF and my neighbor)….a card or ANY kind of acknowledgement would have been nice. No, DH worked until 9, came home and my daughter was here and asked her what she was doing out and about so late with the kiddoes--and she said "we came to give mom her b-day gift". Dh CANNOT fake any emotion, and he said "That's NOT today!" and tried to argue with me about it.
I wouldn't have cared if he's taken me to McDonalds, if he had only remembered.
To some of us, that IS a big deal. And MIL can easily find out if this local treasure of a restaurant is closed. She has enough insults in life, don't add to it.
Not meaning to sound judgy--I just guess once in while I have true sorry for MIL's lot in life. Yeah, she created most of it on her own, but even mean, angry difficult people have feelings. For her, trying to find "joy" in her daily life is daunting and probably impossible.
As long as SIL is insisting that MIL see another facility to approve it, it's going to be a while before that is attempted. And it probably be won't any better than Purgatory. Even if the next roommate is wonderful, that could change overnight.
There would have to be a Medicaid opening at the next place in order for MIL to be transferred, right?
Seafood Shack being remodeled...I love it! Will H go along with that?
Eldercare atty and his associated SW closed case back a couple of months ago.
Yes I had warned SIL (having seen this sorta thing with atty firms from the business side), they charge for everything. Phone calls, emails, etc ... and hefty like, they arent cheap.
I called my dad to see how he fared, post chemo ... thus the news as to Chitapalooza. Also news from him, he cancelled in-home assessment as to PT.
At least for now, too weak he says.
Had explained, encouraged..
as did Oncology, who ordered same, if you want a HHA for hygeine (bathing, says he is too weak to stand for long), you have to be also receiving in home skilled services...otherwise you dont qualify for HHA.
He told me PT was scheduled to come assess but he cancelled (for now).
No I didn't cajole or prod. Doc ofc explained how this works as did I. His choice, his ramifications.
Boundaries.
They dont give ya the warm fuzzies, these boundaries...when YOU KNOW the person "needs".
But to not enact those boundaries is to find one's self now bathing them a few times weekly and having auto now detailed to clean up Chitapalooza and an enormous never ending list of need not satisfiable by one lone soul.
Back to MIL, yes there is talk she wants to move. "We are Family" kind of out of the running as they are AL and its questionable as to her med needs vs an AL setting (that & VA A&A app would need to be in progress to fund AL, that process has seen no action).
Talk is now of another SNF ...one that would've been opted for as favored over Purgatory back when but they didnt take Medicaid Pending, had to nix them.
SIL mentioned if a xfer to said new site is to transpire ... essential MIL go view and sign on before said process gets in motion (I agree).
This other site doesnt offer transport to potential new customers. That would need to be facilitated however family deems appropriate.
Discussion w/SIL that "transport" poses issues .. and also as to "the Shack" ... transport a real issue.
Dont know what they'll do to work that end if they consider a move something they want to look into. On "the Shack"....SIL's suggestion "tell her The Shack is closed for remodeling". Good idea!
Didn't say how bat chit crazy dealt with it. I didn't ask."
Was that yesterday? Did he email or call you, or did you check on him? So much for changing the chemo cocktail to prevent/lessen chitapalooza. So glad you didn't have to be involved, and that YOUR car wasn't messed up.
surprise: "Have you noticed that all of MIL's complaints have come now that she's bored with the facility and doing things with/for/to other people? Perhaps putting her nose in where it does not belong, or maybe even, "stirring the puddin?" Hoping this gets her moved to a "better" place, or even better, home?"
Hasn't MIL been known to make snide comments from time to time? I think surprise might be onto something here!
No further word about moving MIL to a better place? I guess any further consideration of this will wait until SIL is back in Florida? Of course, when SIL returns, MIL's house might take front and center attention.
We don't hear anything more about the attorney or attorney's SW. I understand about the SW -- incredible that SIL didn't realize that the SW was going to be charging for every phone call or contact from SIL! MIL must be fully on Medicaid by now, or is she still in the process of being qualified for it?
Til next time...
CC seems pretty volitile. But who knows, as Surprise put it .. these ladies on various scales of Dementia... who knows what MIL says or does to spark some of this.
In the end, MIL (the one who complains) was offered opportunity to move, and she declined
So either it's not that bad or the fact she likely wouldnt next have a roomie like CC who is gone all day every day, not willing to risk that.
I'm taking bets it will be less than a week and more CC problems.
Oh and on the dad front .. I wasnt on scene ...but he apparently a bad case of Chitapalooza before he could even get home from chemo infusion the other day.
Didnt say how bat chit crazy dealt with it. I didnt ask.
Have you noticed that all of MIL's complaints have come now that she's bored with the facility and doing things with/for/to other people? Perhaps putting her nose in where it does not belong, or maybe even, "stirring the puddin?" Hoping this gets her moved to a "better" place, or even better, home?
I'd let the girls solve their own problems. This is merely another case of roping the family in for attention.
Not sure what they do when the accusations are founded ...
Apparently not much.
Yea Linda, that's kinda my point. What do they do .. I guess if they care (maybe they don't) . if the person is indeed somewhat of a bully and then goes on a tirade against other residents and without real cause. What do they do?
I guess, as is it appears last night, staff member present, . and it sounds like, tried at least, to de-escalate .. not clear . whether that was seen through thoroughly before staff member departed said scene .. or if staff member just threw up hands and exited . who knows.
Apparently, protocol there .. (?) .. it's the "complainer" that has to be the one to move.
Seems like a really extremely poor way of doing things. So, the "complainer" can either be subject to it .. and just take their lumps .. or take the chance .. and "move" .. and maybe end up ... (though she could still end up on the wrong end of the stick in any new roomie, dependent upon whatever "other" issues that new roomie could present with) .. with a roomie that has "other issues".
I don't know what they do to resolve these sorts of things. I truly do not.
Seems it should be like Barb described .. the problematic one . is the one that gets moved and moved and moved and moved again, and when it becomes a situation where they've moved her 12 x's or whatever it is, and problems keep recurring . she gets invited to find another setting entirely ..
But doesn't sound like it works that way here. Who knew?
I truly don't think that MIL is somehow being offensive and instigating any of this .. maybe not even unknowingly.
I mean . at least in this instance, . as told by MIL .. and I guess it can be verified by staff member present . I didn't ask .. but .. all she did was try to verify it's okay to put the laundry altogether, and this sent CC into a tirade. A verbal onslaught.
It'd be hard to decipher in that . how it is that MIL might've been offensive in asking that question. Perhaps CC interpreted it .. that .. MIL should know better than to ask if it's okay .. afterall CC is the queen of long time residence there, . she knows the ropes . how dare you ask if it's really okay to do things that way. Maybe that was what set her off . who can say.
Or the last time .. a week or so ago, when MIL helped the poor woman in Bingo that couldn't hold her hands still and that woman won . that . sent CC into a tirade that MIL helped her cheat . that MIL didn't even need to be there, so on and so forth.
GOOD GRIEF!
One night, roomie started banging a glass bottle on her tray table, uttering expletives. My SIL was there and mom put her head in her hands. SIL texted me.
I wrote an email to the DON, SW and administrator of the facilty and pointed out that our mom was being exposed to a hostile living environment. And that we would be pleased to know what actions were going to be taken to remediate the situation.
The offending person was moved out before 10 the following morning.
As I told SIL: "It's a shame MIL herself isn't altogether there mentally, otherwise she could just look at CC when she gets on a roll and tell her to eff herself . and roll over and go to sleep".
That's how ya deal with bullies.
But .. I don't guess MIL has the capacity to do so . and so .. the verbal onslaughts .. she is captive to it. Until/if .. NH does anything to separate the two .. and they need to.
Sounds like, MIL wants to move from that facility altogether. No easy feat, doesn't happen o'nite . and one fraught with all sorts of .. "be careful you aren't jumping from the frying pan into the fire", . could be she ends up with .. MIL .. and likely so .. just a different set of problems in whatever "other" setting that could turn out to be .. if ever. Fully aware of that, .. SIL is. And . fully aware, one doesn't just up and move, as if this is a hotel that was found to be nasty and I can't stay here, and leaves for a cleaner/safer environment.
The one thing MIL does like, is that CC . .while volatile apparently . .is out of the room the e.n.t.i.r.e. day .. every day .. and so being subject to her tirades ... if it's gonna happen . it would only be at night .. because other than that, CC is outta the room. May not be the case with any other roomie, that may have any other number of "issues" found to be displeasing.
Who knows .. glad I don't have to sort thru these things. Really really glad.
The story goes that .. last night, CC informed MIL "put your dirty clothes in w/mine" (in a hamper there). MIL did so. Later, a staff member came to collect soiled laundry . and MIL asked of said staff member, in some shape/form, not sure what verbiage MIL used. "is that correct, I can put my laundry in the same hamper"
That did it . that sent CC into a tirade, . witnessed apparently by said staff member, who tried to de-escalate the situation telling CC .. "you can't talk to her like that", and like phrases.
I don't know if the staff member considered it all duly de-escalated or just gave up and departed, who knows ...
So this morning, I guess the verbal assault begins again, when CC says she said g'morning to MIL who didn't respond, that then brought on another verbal onslaught.
DON . in a meeting and unavailable, finally appeared .. don't know what was said to MIL on the topic, but I do know what was said to SIL on the topic, from the DON.
Basically, they can move MIL if she'd like, try to find another suitable room/roomie.
I don't think MIL wants to do that, .. I think it's thought that the instigator here (CC) should be the one to have to move . and SIL said this to DON . and DON said, "our policy here is the one who complains is the one who needs to move".
SIL took some pretty firm exception to that, . and said so .. "so you're telling me this woman gets to hand out verbal assault .. and there are no repercussions at all, .. that's not acceptable, this is the 3rd time this has happened, . and to my knowledge there's nothing my mother is doing to warrant this . and it's a known issue there that CC has a tendency to "Go OFF" on folks . she's done it to others, . what are you doing to make sure my mother feels safe/secure .. my mother feels afraid to even go to sleep .. afraid this woman will hit her, or harm her .. ".
DON indicated he'd take it up with Administration and get back with SIL.
I don't know ..
Who knows what actually happened . maybe it is a matter that MIL is doing nothing to warrant this crazy CC and her tirades ... if that's the case, then it's wrong of NH to assume that the victim is the one that has to move.
Maybe MIL is instigating it, by her tone, . or whatever, who can say. I do know the staff member was present and tried to de-escalate all this . so it was witnessed and I would assume it's documented as to who initiated all this and how.
Problem is .. MIL has a view of the grounds .. two beds in that room, MIL's is beside the big picture window, . which then one can view the grounds .. and that's where she'd like to stay. CC's bed is nearer the bathroom, not by the big window. CC has been there in that room, for 7 years . .and I don't know why . but they don't seem to wanna move CC .. seems it's up to the complainer to move, . or so it seems.
I asked SIL . .. (because she called here to let me know, . even though that group text was to both DH and myself, .. she called here, talking to me) .. I asked of SIL: "Would MIL be willing to move . to another room, .. even if it means she loses in the process her big window she can be by?".
SIL: "No . she doesn't wanna have to move, should be CC that has to move".
I dunno how they resolve these matters.
And yes, SIL was informed of the big "Shack" bday request on behalf of her mom, and saw the pitfalls herself . transport, chitapalooza, small non-ADA bathrooms, but made no motion of doing anything to subvert any of it, .. and it's not until November anyway . so .. maybe her thought process is one of, .. put off til tomorrow what doesn't have to be addressed today. Don't know, she didn't say.
MO - yes, .. it's well known there that CC if she gets sideways about something . and warranted or not . she will GO OFF on whoever she needs to.
MIL very well may not be pressing the help button correctly. Or she may not be able to gauge the passage of time.
Does SIL know about the Seafood Shack birthday fantasy yet?
I would let my friend know that her mom was fine, she’s involved in activities etc. In turn my friend would tell me how my mom was doing when she would visit,
My mom passed June 14th, and S took my moms passing very hard. My friend told me that her mom got a new roommate and her mom was a afraid of the roommate, was afraid the woman was going to kill her. Staff moved S to another room, in with the hat lady, she wears multiple hats. S wasn’t happy there. Moved her again, not happy. The lady she was afraid of was only there for two weeks for rehab. So S is on to another room.
MIL I don’t think will be happy with whoever she rooms with. So many personalities with cognitive decline it’s hard for them to be happy.
SIL should definitely find out why MILs requests go unanswered. I had a few Residents who were unpleasant or difficult but that doesn’t mean they get ignored.